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Message: HTML is not enabled. UBB Code™ is enabled.	[QUOTE]Originally posted by RRRICH: [QB] Mr. BNSF - I stand corrected -- yes, I know the decision to cut the International was MDOT and not AMTRAK, and I agree with you that it was a bad mistake to discontinue that service. One comment about train times for MSU students at East Lansing -- I used to live in Lansing, when the old Blue Water first started, and had a similar schedule as that proposed for the current restructuring of the service. But back in the 80's, when I lived in Michigan, the old Blue Water still carried mostly MSU students between East Lansing and Chicago and back, especially over MSU breaks -- by far most of the passengers who caught the Blue Water in the early AM heading toward Chicago were students, and on the way back, most of the eastbound passengers leaving Chicago in the late afternoon were MSU students returning to campus. [/QB][/QUOTE]

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Fan_Trains Member # 2874	posted From Trains.com: Amtrak yesterday officially announced its new "Blue Water" service beginning April 26 between Chicago and Port Huron, Mich. The train will replace the "International", which operates over the same route but continues past the Port Huron to Toronto, Ontario, operating in Canada as a VIA Rail Canada Train. VIA will continue to operate service between Toronto and Sarnia,Ontario, across the border from Port Huron, but neither carrier will offer cross-border service there. The International's scheduled late evening arrivals in Toronto and Chicago meant the train missed virtually all the long-distance-train connections at either end, most affecting central michigan riders who wanted to go farther on Amtrak. Ridership on the International fell 11 percent in Amtrak's most recent fiscal year. The last International will leave each endpoint on April 25. The Blue Water schedule is more Michigan-friendly. Westbound, still as train 365, it will depart Port Huron daily at 5:15 a.m. and arrive in Chicago at 11:10 a.m. Eastbound Blue Water, still train364, will depart Chicago at 3 p.m. and arrive in Port Huron at 10:50 p.m. This schedule will allow passengers to make day trips from Michigan to Chicago and return the same evening. The schedule mirrors the operating pattern of the "Pere Marquette," Amtrak's Grand Rapids, Mich.-Chicago service, trains 370 and 371, also operated under a contract with the Michigan Dept. of Transportation (MDOT). The Blue Water, named for the region of Port Huron, will serve the same intermediate Michigan stops as the International: Lapeer, Flint, Durand, East Lansing, Battle Creek, Kalamazoo, Dowagiac, and Niles. The train operates under a contract with MDOT. The ticket offices at East Lansing, Flint, and Port Huron are among those staffed. well gang what is your reaction?
M190 Member # 3009	posted First of all I'd like to know how to pronounce "Pere Marquette". ??
BNSF 1088 Member # 2400	posted A big loss of ridership. MSU Students make up 85% of the East Lansing station ridership and the students will not take the train with the times it will be running. ------------------ LOOK LISTEN LIVE BEFORE CROSSING RR TRACKS [This message has been edited by BNSF 1088 (edited 02-26-2004).] [This message has been edited by BNSF 1088 (edited 02-26-2004).]
BNSF 1088 Member # 2400	posted I have updated the Save Our Trains Michigan web site. http://mattmarderosian.tripod.com/saveourt...trainsmichigan/
irish1 Member # 222	posted the way to pronounce pere marquette would be pier markett. i hope that helps ------------------ The Copper Country Limited [Milwaukee Road] and the Peninsula 400 [CNW} still my favorites [This message has been edited by irish1 (edited 02-26-2004).]
RRRICH Member # 1418	posted Sounds like the same schedule the Blue Water originally had back in the 80's when it first started. But BOOOO!!!!!! and thumbs down, AMTRAK for discontinuing the International to Toronto. [This message has been edited by RRRICH (edited 02-27-2004).]
Italiancanuck89 Member # 1873	posted I'm never a fan of cutting routes but I guess, Amtrak has to do what Amtrak has to do. I guess the way to look at this or any other discontinuation of a route, is that if Amtrak doesn't do these things, there won't be an Amtrak, and such avid fans like ourselves would be at a complete loss.
BNSF 1088 Member # 2400	posted Amtrak is not cutting this out Michigan Department Of Transportation is the one behind this since this is a State supported train Amtrak has no choice but to go along with what M-DOT says which is a big mistake.And this might cause both the Bluewater and the Pere Marquette to be lost in Oct 1st 2004 when the money issue comes up and the reason i say this is there will be a loss in ridership on the Bluewater.
coachclass Member # 2382	posted I think this change is a great idea. The International was a slow, poor performing route with declining ridership with limited amenities and its times did not offer good connections to other long distance trains at either Chicago or Toronto. The Blue Water will gain in ridership by encouraging people to travel to/from Chicago, making one day round trips possible and offering better connections to other trains. The Pere Marquette follows a similar schedule and has seen its ridership increase dramatically over the past year. An additional plus is that only one set of equipment will be needed now, meaning much needed coaches can be freed up to use on other busy routes.
BNSF 1088 Member # 2400	posted We already have a bus setup for connections from Flint & East Lansing for trains 351 353 352 354.And not many people off the International line make connections into CHI.The reason i am telling you this my Friend was the Ticket Agent in East Lansing before M-DOT took the agents out. The ridership from this line is from Canada and the Students from MSU like i have said before you put a 100 passengers on in East Lansing 85 of those passengers are Students the Students will not ride the Bluewater because of the times it will leave East Lansing you people that want the Bluewater need to know that if ridership drops which it will come Oct 1st 2004 just might kill both the Bluewater and Pere Marquette.As you know that i am the Leader Of Save Our Trains Michigan our group has been told by Rep Hager office that if we did not get involved with last years money issue we would not have the Pere Marquette or the International/Bluewater.The Reps for Michigan do not want to see a decline in ridership and that is what is going to happen our group has talked with stundents and passengers and they do not want the International to go and the passengers we talked to will not be able to ride the Bluewater this might look good for Railfans to take a 1 day trip to CHI but this could kill passenger service in Michigan.And the delays are not from Customs there from the Freight RR that the International runs on just because it is late leaving Port Huron does not mean it is customs that train can sit there for over an hour to wait for Freight trains to pass.I am not against the Bluewater if M-DOT would run 2 trainsets keep 364 on the time it is running now and make 365 get into East Lansing around 5pm we could increase ridership from the students they would not have to miss class plus with that time passengers in Port Huron wouldn't have to miss a whole day at work you could also increase ridership. ------------------ LOOK LISTEN LIVE BEFORE CROSSING RR TRACKS
RRRICH Member # 1418	posted Mr. BNSF - I stand corrected -- yes, I know the decision to cut the International was MDOT and not AMTRAK, and I agree with you that it was a bad mistake to discontinue that service. One comment about train times for MSU students at East Lansing -- I used to live in Lansing, when the old Blue Water first started, and had a similar schedule as that proposed for the current restructuring of the service. But back in the 80's, when I lived in Michigan, the old Blue Water still carried mostly MSU students between East Lansing and Chicago and back, especially over MSU breaks -- by far most of the passengers who caught the Blue Water in the early AM heading toward Chicago were students, and on the way back, most of the eastbound passengers leaving Chicago in the late afternoon were MSU students returning to campus.
BNSF 1088 Member # 2400	posted The reason the Bluewater was cut in the 80s was because of low ridership due to the times it ran.What makes anyone think that starting it back up is going to increase ridership.The thing we all have to remember is all the State Reps that passed the House Bill to lift the Cap on Amtrak are going out on term limits.And if they see low ridership on any of these trains we could not have any State Funded Train service in Michigan Amtrak is going to ask the State Of Michigan for $8 million for year 2005.Also the way the State Funded trains are set up for the Pere Marquette and International/Bluewater is if 1 goes they both go no exceptions. ------------------ LOOK LISTEN LIVE BEFORE CROSSING RR TRACKS

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