1. Determine if the behaviour is solely directed towards you and your situation - Be observant. Watch the person and see if his or her tightness is directed towards you and you alone. If it is, re-evaluate your own approach and take some responsibility! If you were rude to them and they retaliated by exhibiting the same behaviour, go back after a bit and apologize, reapproach, maybe once the heat is over.

2. Evaluate the level of tension on the train. Is the train five hours late? Can you sense the buzz of disgruntled passengers in the air? Do most people look miserable? Is the train sold out? All these factors contribute to a crew's sense of well-being as well as the passengers. I don't personally think it's fair to judge people on a one time bad day. Tense situations will breed terse words, trust me.

3. If you feel the need to vent because the train is late or oversold, try to wait until you are settled a bit, thirty minutes, longer if necessary -after- the stop where you got on. That is the time where everyone else is pouncing on the conductors/crew so their patience will be thinner. If you can hold on a bit, you may find a not so rude person dealing back with you.

4. Bar/lounge car/Coach Attendants - So this rude person tells you to have a seat, doesn't have a pillow for you, and snaps at a woman asking where the bathroom is... what do you do? Report it to the Conductor. He's in charge. A bar-car person is an ass? Don't tip and don't go back unless you're starving. Also report him to the Conductor.

5. Dining car staff - This, in my opinion, is probably the easiest situation to deal with, since most people only see this staff for a small period of time. Here's what you do, ask the server to speak to the Attendant in charge, that's usually the one either taking reservations or taking the cash. Tell them of your problem, whether it be that the food is awful or the server is rude, and I guarantee you that they will try and rectify the situation immediately. If that doesn't work and you're really unlucky and the in charge is an idiot? Report it to the Conductor. If the place is packed and now is not a good time to approach, don't tip the rude server, ask the in charge when you're paying your bill for a moment's time after the breakfast/lunch/dinner rush and deal with it then.

6. When you get home - Report them! Don't call, that usually does no good, -write- a letter. Most people wear name tags, we're required to, in fact, so if you can get their names, great, if you can not, the train number and date will let Amtrak know precisely who worked. Give a detailed account of what happened and who was involved, state clearly in the letter that a copy has been kept for your personal records and if others around you were treated in the same manner, urge them to do the same. You may not get that person fired but not only will you start a paperwork trail but you will probably be gifted with a certificate for future travel or a partial refund.

The reason we still have disgruntled, rude employees with no social graces whatsoever is because people tend to take a trip, have an incident, get off the train and then completely forget about it or don't do anything about it. If after you've calmed you still can't stand how you were treated, I -urge- you, please, please do something about it. It's the only way we'll ever weed them out.

We all deserve to be treated with human kindness and respect, when that fails to happen, we remember it always but we are never helpless. You, the rider, have the power to make Amtrak a better place. I can guarantee you that the company wants to keep you coming back.

quote:

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Originally posted by ShaLeah:
I -urge- you, please, please do something about it. It's the only way we'll ever weed them out.

ShaL

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I had a 16 year absence from Amtrak between 1984 and 2000. I can tell you that on-board service is vastly superior to what it was in the 1970s, but there is still room for improvement.

Whenever a customer complains he or she is giving Amtrak an opportunity to fix the problem. A customer who goes away grumbling to himself isn't doing anyone any good.

One question. Is it effective to write via the "Contact Us" e-mail form on the Amtrak website, or is a paper letter better?

------------------
Trust God, love your neighbor, and never mistake opinion for truth.
-Mr. Toy

With all due respect, I take this opportunity to respectfully disagree with just about everything you have written.

Amtrak is at a crossroads now, in more ways than just one. It is time for people to realize that when they climb aboard the train, they are not boarding a cruise ship.

Amtrak is a distinctly American means of transportation. And it has transformed since the days when I was kicking the slats out of my cradle and many people around here were lounging in the lap of luxury.

Cruise ships, and I have been on quite a few, employ people from third world country who rely on tips to make a living. They normally make about a dollar a day in wages.

In America, things are different and people who board Amtrak must realize that they are interacting with their equals.

I don't go for this "call the supervisor crap." I gave up flying over five years ago and I have travelled tens of thousands of miles on Amtrak and I have come to the conclusion that lots of the passengers are just, plain simply, wrong about their expectations of what the world "service" means.

Just put yourself in the place of an Amtrak employee in the year 2003. These people don't even know if they will have a job tomorrow. They work under incredible stress and just because you or somebody else isn't getting the service you expect, you want to get them in trouble? I say that that is an incredible disrespectful, immoral and unethical approach to the matter.

Amtrak employees are not slaves and we, as railfans, should be doing everything in our power to defend them, not get them in trouble.

So listen up, all you railfans, the next time somebody picks on an Amtrak employee, I want you to defend them with the last bit of your moral fiber. I want you raise your voice high and embarrass the hell out of their accuser. I want you to put these trouble makers in their place.

With Mr. Bush in office, this country is divided and stratified quite enough, thank you. It's time for those of us who love rail to choose sides and stand up for what is right.

For the love of everything that is decent, we're not talking about the American Orient Express here. We're talking about Amtrak. We're talking about an organization that runs a 30,000 mile network for less money than it takes for the Bay Area Rapid Transit to run its puny 97 mile railway.

Let's forget about getting people "in trouble." Let's stand up for our brothers and sisters on the front lines!

quote:

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One question. Is it effective to write via the "Contact Us" e-mail form on the Amtrak website, or is a paper letter better?[/B]

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A paper letter is better.

quote:

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Originally posted by Chucky:
ShaLeah,

With all due respect, I take this opportunity to respectfully disagree with just about everything you have written.

Amtrak is at a crossroads now, in more ways than just one. It is time for people to realize that when they climb aboard the train, they are not boarding a cruise ship.

Amtrak is a distinctly American means of transportation. And it has transformed since the days when I was kicking the slats out of my cradle and many people around here were lounging in the lap of luxury.

Cruise ships, and I have been on quite a few, employ people from third world country who rely on tips to make a living. They normally make about a dollar a day in wages.

In America, things are different and people who board Amtrak must realize that they are interacting with their equals.

I don't go for this "call the supervisor crap." I gave up flying over five years ago and I have travelled tens of thousands of miles on Amtrak and I have come to the conclusion that lots of the passengers are just, plain simply, wrong about their expectations of what the world "service" means.

Just put yourself in the place of an Amtrak employee in the year 2003. These people don't even know if they will have a job tomorrow. They work under incredible stress and just because you or somebody else isn't getting the service you expect, you want to get them in trouble? I say that that is an incredible disrespectful, immoral and unethical approach to the matter.

Amtrak employees are not slaves and we, as railfans, should be doing everything in our power to defend them, not get them in trouble.

So listen up, all you railfans, the next time somebody picks on an Amtrak employee, I want you to defend them with the last bit of your moral fiber. I want you raise your voice high and embarrass the hell out of their accuser. I want you to put these trouble makers in their place.

With Mr. Bush in office, this country is divided and stratified quite enough, thank you. It's time for those of us who love rail to choose sides and stand up for what is right.

For the love of everything that is decent, we're not talking about the American Orient Express here. We're talking about Amtrak. We're talking about an organization that runs a 30,000 mile network for less money than it takes for the Bay Area Rapid Transit to run its puny 97 mile railway.

Let's forget about getting people "in trouble." Let's stand up for our brothers and sisters on the front lines!

---

Duly noted and no offense taken.

Fact: I am an Amtrak employee, I know -precisely- the amount of pressure that comes with the job and I made a conscious decision to post knowing full well that other Amtrak employees may not feel the same way. I am confident that in situations where such measures should be, no, -need- to be taken, I will not be affected. I happen to think I am an excellent employee and yes, I have had bad days where I have told a passenger precisely where to go. For every shmuck out there working the train, there are ten-fold more shmucks riding the train, nonetheless I stand firm, if a person in -this- service industry is -continuously- rude, he or she needs to be dealt with. I'm sorry you disagree with that.

I am proud of what I do. I know my level of service far surpasses that of airline stewards and though I have respect for my fellow employees there are far too many people who should not be in this industry that work for it anyway and make -my- job harder. I agree, Amtrak is -not- the American Orient Express, I for one, would like it to be. I don't particularly like being mediocre though.

A clarification, Amtrak workers, particularly lounge car attendants and first class workers -do- work for tips so the cruise ship analogy doesn't quite work.

What does "service" mean to you? A quiet ride? A pillow? Hot coffee? The point of my post is to try and let people know, as riders and rail fans, that being treated like crap is not acceptible and that treating the workers like that isn't acceptible either. I am -not- saying that it is okay to treat service employees rudely simply because they are serving you. I'm not saying that in any way, if you got that from my post, I'm sorry, that is not what I meant in the least.

Chucky is right that some people have excessive expectations of good service. Even in our hotel where service is as good as it gets, some people will find things to complain about. Some of these people arrive angry over something completely unrelated to our service, and any inconveninece, no matter how minor, will set them off. All you can do is smile and do the best you can. There is a difference between a bad employee and a good one just having a bad day. The former will have a pattern of complaints against him/her, while with the latter a complaint will be an anomaly on his/her record.

But make no mistake, there are some bad Amtrak employees out there and there's no way I will defend them. They are only hurting Amtrak's reputation and need to go.

For example, Three years ago my mother and sister were on the Coast Starlight (coach). They put in their name for breakfast and were told that they would be called over the PA. They waited in the lounge. After some time had passed with no announcement my sister went to inquire and found the diner had closed! She went to the steward who said she had called them then proceeded to scold my sister for not showing up. Yet there was no announcement. How do I know this?

This was back when they still had Chiefs on board, and so my sister complained to him. He told my sister that the PA in the lounge was out of order, and the steward had been instructed to make duplicate announcements in the lounge in person. The steward had not done this, and then placed the blame on my sister. The Chief set things right and my family was happy.

Granted, such incidents are fairly rare, and I have never encountered anything like this myself (not since the '70s anyway). But I still read reports now and then of sleeping car attendants who vanish for hours on end, and if you'll read Mr. William's recent trip report, there was a horribly mismanaged dining car on the SW Chief.

True, customers shouldn't expect five star service, but three star service isn't too much to ask. Amtrak's existence may depend on it. One bad apple can spoil the trip for a first-time traveler, who will go away and never come back. Even worse, he'll tell his friends what a bad trip he had and they won't try Amtrak at all. These are often among the people who are calling for Amtrak's demise.

As a service employee myself, I can relate to the pressures on the Amtrak employees, and I have lot of admiration for them. After every trip I have taken, I have written to Amtrak to name and praise every good employee I encountered. But if I ever get a bad one, you can be sure Amtrak will know about that, too.

------------------
Trust God, love your neighbor, and never mistake opinion for truth.
-Mr. Toy

The Del Monte Club Car

About 70% of the Amtrak employees we have encountered in our 40,000 miles+ adventures have done their jobs in a pleasant and efficient manner.

About 25% have been outstanding and are working in the profession they were meant to be working in.

About 5% need to find a different job.

I have written Amtrak on a number of occasions, due to problems encountered in our travels, and I always praise the employees that have gone out of their way to smooth over the bumps in each trip, or the one's that go well beyond the "call of duty".

Maybe I'll mention the 5% that don't fit. I haven't done that in the past.

quote:

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Originally posted by ShaLeah:

Duly noted and no offense taken.

Fact: I am an Amtrak employee, I know -precisely- the amount of pressure that comes with the job and I made a conscious decision to post knowing full well that other Amtrak employees may not feel the same way. I am confident that in situations where such measures should be, no, -need- to be taken, I will not be affected. I happen to think I am an excellent employee and yes, I have had bad days where I have told a passenger precisely where to go. For every shmuck out there working the train, there are ten-fold more shmucks riding the train, nonetheless I stand firm, if a person in -this- service industry is -continuously- rude, he or she needs to be dealt with. I'm sorry you disagree with that.

I am proud of what I do. I know my level of service far surpasses that of airline stewards and though I have respect for my fellow employees there are far too many people who should not be in this industry that work for it anyway and make -my- job harder. I agree, Amtrak is -not- the American Orient Express, I for one, would like it to be. I don't particularly like being mediocre though.

A clarification, Amtrak workers, particularly lounge car attendants and first class workers -do- work for tips so the cruise ship analogy doesn't quite work.

What does "service" mean to you? A quiet ride? A pillow? Hot coffee? The point of my post is to try and let people know, as riders and rail fans, that being treated like crap is not acceptible and that treating the workers like that isn't acceptible either. I am -not- saying that it is okay to treat service employees rudely simply because they are serving you. I'm not saying that in any way, if you got that from my post, I'm sorry, that is not what I meant in the least.

I am only saying that I would rather have to take two extra trips a week because we fired a total arse than to have to live with the consequences of that arse's continued employment.

---

quote:

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Originally posted by RRRICH:
BTW, what trains do you work on, ShaLeah?

---

I appreciate the time you spent responding to my post. I did not realize you are an Amtrak employee and in retrospect, many of your points make good, solid sense.

I want to take this opportunity, however, to get some stuff off my chest.

First off, as much as I am totally dedicated to the survival of Amtrak, I do realize that there is some despirate need for improvement. And unlike a lot of people on this board, I don't want to focus on customer service. At least, I don't want to focus on it until the railroad is properly funded.

Many of the problems that occur on a train ride have their origin in cars that are literally falling to pieces. Passengers need to understand this and maybe pitch in and try to help figure out how to fix them, rather than fix blame. Employees, on the other hand, need to go the extra mile.

For example, a conductor may feel that it is not his job to figure out why a door between coach cars is not closing. He may feel that since it's 10 p.m. and near the end of his shift, it "not my job." But is the solution to this problem is not to forget about it and hope it goes away.

Do passengers really have to get an earful of the wretched noise generated by two cars smashing against each other all through the night? If that happened to me during my shift, I would wake up everybody, from the chef to the engineer and we would find a solution to this problem, one way or another.

Furthermore, I understand that tips are expected when travelling first class. I am totally into tipping people and I tip well. However, the reference to cruise ships is not totally without merit because people who work on cruise ships rely entirely on wages for their livelihood. Amtrak employees get a regular salary and whatever else they may get is (well-deserved) icing on the cake.

Another thing, I'm beginning to think that the same sort of ingenuity that went into creating "Julie" should be used to better organize the way cash, tickets and seating assignments are handled. First off, why doesn't the cafe car take plastic? Why is cash thrown into a little metal box? Where's the accountability here? Second, why are trains being over (and under?) booked. With the evident sophistication of the on-line booking system, such incidents should never occur.

Third, is it my imagination or have recent postings suggested a certain chaos that prevails in the dining car? If first class passengers have their meals included in their ticket, then it seems right for them to have their own specific time for eating, just like on cruise ships. That way they won't have to wait for an announcement that will never occur because the PA system doesn't work. That way they will never have to deal with the dining room running out of food.

Personally, I'm beginning to think that maybe Amtrak should not include the cost of meals on first class tickets. Maybe they should just pay for their rooms, period and then let them pay for their food as they go. I'm beginning to think that there may be some accountability problems in this area, as well.

From what I have seen and heard (and personally experienced) shipping bags on Amtrak is problematic, to say the least. I have never actually lost a bag, but I did have one taken off in Kansas City by mistake. The bag was found but the whole situation stressed me out somewhat.

Also, since train travel is becoming very popular, I think it would be worth Amtrak's while to publish some sort of booklet for passengers to read on basic etiquette and survival tactics, as well as rules. People don't come out of the womb with the knowledge that trains can be delayed because of freight traffic. Lots of them don't know that they can be thrown off the train for drinking themselves into oblivion. There's no reason for you to have to explain things when they can read all about it.

My hat is off to Amtrak and its employees. About the only time I ever got mad was 1) when you all lost my bag and 2) when I actually had the opportunity to look into a baggage car and see, with my own eyes, how primitive the business of storing bags actually is. Otherwise, I let my frustrations run off my back like water on a duck.

I fully understand that Amtrak is one of the most affordable and enjoyable way for me to get from point A to point B. A trip on Amtrak means basic transportation to me (since I am unable to fly). My expectations are not that lofty and as high as your expectations are of your employees, I only desire efficiency, creativity and an overall concern about safety.

Smiling and politeness is ok too, but only if you really mean it. Making people smile is probably a fundamental flaw with our society.

I am curious though, how Amtrak/railroad employees got turned on to this site/forum.

I would think you all are sick of trains at the days end. Could it be that some of you are railfans at heart?

Publishing a survival guide wouldn't work because people don't even read the rules and regulations inside a timetable or the little ticket-wrappers.
Unfortunately, this is America and sometimes people have to be told to behave themselves.

Cash registers (instead of the infamous lockbox) in the Cafe cars are on the agenda. You may begin seeing them in the near future. As for Mr. Gunn, he wrote about someone he caught smoking in the vestibule of a coach on a train he rode. He understands the need for restraint, but the point of the anectdote was that he *will* fire the person on the spot next time.

Working on a train is so often a story of endurance since you work for ten hours (timetable) at a stretch, get some rest, and turn around and do it again. You don't have an hour before the plane lands, it's much longer than that. Just remember, Rygel says "I make allowances for stress on this ship."
Also, train travel is definitely changing. So are the people. Increased popularity becomes ridership. That means the chance to have a pair of seats to yourself overnight is dwindling, so DON'T count on it.
I still ride trains to see the country and meet people.

You can write the word describing donkeys on this board but you can't use the word describing a canine pet???

I wish you'd be a little bit more coherent because I think you have something very valuable to offer. Smoking cigarettes is a hugely important issue to me. I don't smoke, and like every self-righteous arsehole whoever lifted a cigarette to their lips at one time or another, I really don't want anybody else to smoket either.

For the love of God, its 2003 and its time that people just kicked the habit. There is nowhere in America, except seedy bars and strip joints (and certain cars on the Southwest Chief) where smoking is aloud. HELLO! Where did you people get the idea that some lounge car on the bottom level of the Southwest Chief was a sacred place for you to exhale your noxious fumes?

Do you honestly think those cigarette gases would not make their way to the upper level of the coach cars? Well, sorry! That lower level is not hermetically sealed and I can smell you! So either learn to quit that vile habit (worse then heroin) or take Greyhound.

And ShaLeah, I've been waiting for your tactful, polite response. Look, I know we all hate change, but change is gonna happen, whether you like it or not.

Us Amtrak riders don't want smiley, polite service. What we want is clean windows and toilets that work. We want you to do whatever you can, even if it means crossing the sacred boundaries of job description, to give us passengers sanitary, safe, traveling conditions.

I know you are a manager, but from what everything I have read (and I have read quite a bit) Mr. David Gunn would have pitched right in and figured out a way to close that damn coach door, he would have figured out a way of unplugging that stopped holding tank, he would have figured out a way of adding another coach car, and he would have figured out a way of making that old PA system work, all without making anybody smile when they did not want to smile.

Cordially,

Chucky

------------------
Trust God, love your neighbor, and never mistake opinion for truth.
-Mr. Toy

Let's see.. where to start...

Don't even get me started on the funding. Two years ago the government batted not one lash and gave the airline business BILLIONS of dollars to do whatever it is they do with that money, in addition, the US government subsidizes airline fuel, and yet, though planes get grounded and the only thing running is a train, we have to literally beg... it sincerely makes me ill. I'll not get into that rant to spare us all a headache.

I've been lucky, any time there has been a mechanical problem on the train, such as the doors not closing, each conductor has tried to remedy the situation, some things they just can't do, I'm afraid. You're right, something needs to be done with this equipment, my -personal- opinion is that -someone- is -not- doing their job. There have been times when prior to departure I have caught a something broken, called for assistance on it and there is not one mechanical person in sight, not one. I find that unacceptible, myself. Furthermore, Amtrak seems to have bred an entire race of lazy people who have become masters at passing the buck. We -seriously- need to leave that guy smoking alone and crack down on that mechanical guy who instead of fixing that door, toilet, light and heating system, was napping in one of the coaches. I mean, really, learn to prioritize.

On the matter of publishing a do and don't for the train...

As Amtrak207 stated, what would be the purpose? When was the last time any of you read the emergency information brochure on a train or plane? Believe you me, for everyone that -does- read them, there are thousands more that do not. Amtrak has a strict policy to NOT solicit tips so mentioning that it's "proper" to tip an attendant would go against that, they won't do that either. I've often thought about starting a website just to inform passengers of the do's and do not's of train travel along with a few tips which will make their trip easier and more pleasant, I'm still debating that, maybe I will and maybe when people key in amtrak I'll get some hits. *chuckle* At least we'll educate the computer people, right?

Amtrak should not only include the cost of meals for the sleepers (something which I will be very disappointed if they discontinue), but in my most humble opinion, they should sell meal vouchers for coach people as well. For an added $X, you can add your meals and be fed on the train, for those who don't want that, there's always a cafe. One of the most enjoyable experiences on the train is the dining car and while mishaps can happen, I would still be disappointed if they did away with it. The dining car is a HUGE source of revenue.

In closing, I have found that a train trip with a crapload (pardon the crass english) of mishaps is made much more tolerable when you have employees that know how to deal with and diffuse a situation. In my opinion, Amtrak would be a smashing success if everyone would look at their employ with pride. Efficiency, creativity and an overall concern about safety should automatically breed pride, no? As I said before, I love my job, even on the worst day it's still pretty darned good, I can't rightly expect everyone to love it, but if you're dragging behind those who do, you should get out of the way, make way for those who -want- the job, from the coach cleaners to the engineers and dispatchers.

In a perfect rail world, I'd love to see the Acela trains take over, they are a beautiful thing to ride. Of course, though, I'm biased.

Before then, when I was train-tripping, I would open the vestibule window about 3 inches. That created a draft that pulled ALL cigarette smoke out the window (assuming the train was moving). You could stand 3 feet away from me and not smell any smoke. My wife smoked her cigars that way (they are not allowed in the smoking section) with no problems until a conductor came downstairs to go to the bathroom..... OOPS!!!!

The last two years, I've been on trains that had the smoking section vented to the outside and I could not smell any cigarette smoke in the upper coach section. They finally took my advise to vent to the outside, similar to the vestibule windows. (Yes, I wrote several letters....)