I'm a great fan of Elvis Presley and trying to establish how he got from Memphis to mostly New York and Los Angeles back in 1956, 1957 and 1960.
I know that in the evening of March 5, 1960 he took a private railroad car out of New York to Washington, D.C. where he boarded the Tennessean which left for Memphis at 8:05 a.m. on March 6 and arrived in Memphis at 7:45 a.m. the next day. So he would have been on the move for at least 36 hours. Was that the general time for a trainride New York-Memphis back then??
How long time would it take from Memphis to Los Angeles back then?? I know that sometimes he routed via New Orleans or Dallas.
Is there anywhere on the internet where I can get access to old time-tables runnig out of Memphis? Or anywhere else?
Looking forward to hearing from anybody who can help me in any way.
posted
That was the time of the Tennessean. All train schedules were contained in the timetables published by the various railroads. An easier way to get the information is find a copy of the 'Official Guide to the Railways'. This was published monthly and contained the schedules for all railroads in North America. You should be able to find old copies in a google search, on ebay, or one of the many railroad shows in the U.S.
Also try Carl Loucks - chloucks@sbcglobal.net. They sell old guides as well as timetables.
If I was Elvis (and we do have a Pressley on this forum but he claims that he is Notelvis) I would have taken two of the finest trains in the country at the time. The overnight Panama Limited to Chicago and then the 39 hour Super Chief to Los Angeles - a train that was the choice of the movie stars in the 40's-50's.
Posts: 2397 | From: Camden, SC | Registered: Mar 2006
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posted
True. I am not Elvis.....but I did spend a year living in Memphis in the early 1980's.
Now if Elvis were going to Los Angeles from Memphis in a private rail car, he may have opted to go directly west behind a Rock Island Passenger to Little Rock, Oklahoma and then a connection to the Golden State Rocket.
By the time the CR&P route faded, I imagine Elvis would have been flying everywhere.
Now the Tennessean......that would be an interesting route....New York to Washington on the Pennsy, southward to Lynchburg on Southern then via Norfolk and Western through Roanoke to Bristol, TN and back to Southern via Knoxville, Chattanooga, and Sheffield, AL.
I can think of a worse way to spend 36 hours.
-------------------- David Pressley
Advocating for passenger trains since 1973!
Climbing toward 5,000 posts like the Southwest Chief ascending Raton Pass. Cautiously, not nearly as fast as in the old days, and hoping to avoid premature reroutes. Posts: 4203 | From: Western North Carolina | Registered: Feb 2004
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You can find old Official Guides quite frequently on ebay. go to collectibles, transportation, railroadiana, paper, and then look in public timetables, employee timetables, or books. They do not seem to know where to categorize these things.
New York to Memphis: From the 1940's until its demise in about 1966, the Tennessean took right at 24 hours Memphis to Washington DC. For much at that time it carried a through sleeper to/from New York, and you spent the first part of the night southbound and the last part of it northbound parked in Penn Station. His actual on the move time would have been around 28 to 29 hours. There were alternatives: Pennsylvania RR to Cincinatti and Louisville and Nashville from there. Don't recall the schedule out of New York, but it was daytime Cincinatti to Memphis. The through sleeper dissapeared in the mid to late 1950's, but the train itself lasted up to about 1965. Some people also took a Pennsylvania RR St. Louis train to Effingham, Illinois and changed to one of the Illinois Central's Chicago to Memphis trains there, but there were never any through cars on this routing.
Memphis to Los Angeles: There were about 3 relatively fast and direct ways of doing this, and a couple more less direct ways. The most commonly used appeared to be either:
Missouri Pacific - Texas Pacific - Southern Pacific: Memphis - Little Rock, Arkansas - Dallas - Ft. Worth - El Paso - Los Angeles A change of sleeper was required in either Dallas or Ft. Worth on this route. I do not have the schedule at hand, but there were two trains out of Memphis that became part of through St. Louis to Texas trains in Little Rock. The evening train, which left about 8:30 pm became part of the Texas Eagle. I think this required 3 nights.
Take one of the Illinois Central train to New Orleans, take the Sunset Limited from there, same route as it has now, except that it did go through Phoenix.
Take the Frisco all day train to Kansas City and then get either the Santa Fe's Super Chief, another ATSF train, or the Rock Island's Golden State. This would be two days and two nights. The better Frisco train out of Memphis was the Kansas City - Florida Special which ran overnight between Memphis and Kansas City, but I think the connections west from there were not as good.
There were numerous other Memphis to Los Angeles permutations possible of more or less reasonableness.
The Memphis-Californian which ran Chichag Rock Island and Pacific from Memphis to Little Rock - Oklahoma City - Amorilla - Tucumcari NM where it became part of the Southern Pacific's Imperial for the rest of the run to Los Angeles. If you liked heavyweight equipment and a relatively slow schedule, this was your train. Sleepers were gone before 1960.
From Frisco to Kansas City, take Union Pacific west to Denver, then Ogden and the City of Los Angeles from there, or go north from Kansas City to Omaha on either the Birlington or the Missouri Pacific and take a Union Pacific train from there.
If you took the Missouri Pacific train to Dallas first mentioned, leaving on the day train, you could get an unnamed ATSF train that carried a sleeper through to Los Angeles on a series of secondary lines across Texas and New Mexico, joining the ATSF passenger main at Albuquerque.
Posts: 2810 | From: Olive Branch MS | Registered: Nov 2002
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posted
Thank you very much for your very helpful replies. I'll see if I can get my hands on one of those Guides but your explanations have already helped me a lot. I couldn't understand why Elvis in March 1961 was in Chicago when he was in fact on his way out to Hollywood. That seemed so far out of way. Now I understand that he took the choice of the movie stars. Sometimes he went as an ordinary passenger and was seated amongst them, even when he went home to Memphis after his appearance on the Steve Allen show when he was on the top.
After the military service he went on a private rail car to L.A. on the Sunset Limited.
Is there any maps of the railroad net anywhere on the internet??
Thanks very much for you kind and quick replies. You have been very helpful.
quote:Originally posted by notelvis: Now if Elvis were going to Los Angeles from Memphis in a private rail car, he may have opted to go directly west behind a Rock Island Passenger to Little Rock, Oklahoma and then a connection to the Golden State Rocket.
The problem with the Rock Island was that the through train west out of Memphis connected with the Imperial, which even in the early 50's was not exactly a train of choice due to a fairly slow schedule and all older heavyweight equipment. The Choctaw Rocket only went as far west as Amorillo, so did not connect with the Golden State or anything else, unless maybe you could do a decent transfer to one of the ATSF secondary trains at Amorillo. A private TRAIN to connect him with the Golden State was probably beyond even Elvis's budget.
Straight north on the Panama Limited to Chicago would make a reasonable connection to the Super Chief, and be as fast or faster than the shorter run in distance going west on the MoPac. Likewise, at one time the Sunset Limited departed New Orleans at about 12:30 midnight so you could make a 15 minute or thereabout connection from the City of New Orleans having left Memphis at 5:15 pm. Don't remember what the eastbound was like, but now thinking about it, I know that more than in the 50's a few people considered ICRR - New Orleans - SPRR the better way between Memphis and Houston than MoPac all the way.
Posts: 2810 | From: Olive Branch MS | Registered: Nov 2002
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Thanks for the clarification George. I should have gone to the old Official Guides myself before posting based on assumption!
-------------------- David Pressley
Advocating for passenger trains since 1973!
Climbing toward 5,000 posts like the Southwest Chief ascending Raton Pass. Cautiously, not nearly as fast as in the old days, and hoping to avoid premature reroutes. Posts: 4203 | From: Western North Carolina | Registered: Feb 2004
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posted
Sunset was on Southern Pacific. Trains 1 and 2. The post midnight departure time I mentioned was true in 1950. Later it was moved to an earlier time and the City of New Orleans out of Memphis connection became no longer possible. Do not know when that happened.
In the late 50's and later, over half of all rail passenger in and out of Memphis were using ICRR trains, the majority to/from points north, but a lot to/from points south as well.
Posts: 2810 | From: Olive Branch MS | Registered: Nov 2002
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I know that he went by train from mephis to Los Angeles on January 9, 1957 but don't know which routing he chose. He arrived back in Memphis at 11:35 p.m. via New Orleans on March 18
On March 27, 1957 he left Memphis at 11:45 p.m. for Chicago.
Left for L.A. nighttime on April 26, 1957
On June 27 he was back in Memphis at 12:45 a.m. after having gotten off the train in Lafayette where he rented a 57 Chevrolet and drove the last part.
Aug 27, 1957 he left Memphis at 11 p.m. for Spokane, Wa. arriving 11:20 p.m. 48 hours later.
From Portland, Or. 4:45 p.m. to Los Angeles on Sept 3.
Sept 9, left Los Angeles in the evening/night arriving in Memphis at 10 p.m. on the 11th after having gotten off the train in Houston and driven home.
Jan 10, 1958, left for Los Angeles by train.
Arrived in Memphis at 6:30 p.m. on March 14, 1958 after having gotten off in Dallas where he rented a string of Cadillacs for himself and his party for the 500 mile drive home.
Then we move forward to March 6, 1960 where Sgt. Elvis Presley left Washington, D.C. on the Tennessean at 8:05 a.m. for Memphis.
On April 18, 1960 he and his party rented two private cars on the Southern Pacific Sunset Limited at a cost of $2.424.41. He arrived late at night two days later.
Well, those are about the times he went by train for long trips. Later on he would drive by his private bus, fly commercial airlines and eventually go by his own Convair 800 jet.
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