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Good Evening all - I'm holed up in my room at a Quality Inn in Hollywood, FL (NOT as far above Red Roof as I had hoped but I am staying gratis using 'Choice Hotels' points.)
Earlier today, after winding through a classic car show which had closed much of downtown off, I managed to reach the Winter Park, FL Amtrak station and pick up my tickets for a round-trip on the Silver Star with less than five minutes to spare before #91 rolled in five minutes early.
I had anticipated picking up my tickets from the quick-track machine BUT no one was in the tiny waiting room and the agent called me up to the window where he asked to see my photo ID (something which I am rarely asked for on Amtrak) and also to see my National Association of Railroad Passengers ID as I had the 10% NARP discount on my tickets.
This was the first time I have ever been asked for my NARP ID card by anyone at Amtrak and, frankly, I was a little surprised. Maybe in Florida Amtrak agents have been instructed to pay closer attention to policy than the ones I have encountered in other states normally do....or maybe I just looked harried and suspicious by the time I got into the station.
The Silver Star this morning had it's 'typical' consist of two locomotives, a baggage car, four amfleet II coaches, the lounge car, a Heritage fleet diner which may be 60 years old now, and a pair of Viewliner sleepers.
The coaches were maybe 90% full......as in only an empty aisle seat here and there. In Orlando there may have been 70 or 80 passengers off.....but another 50 or 60 on. Rolling through Kissimmee, Lakeland, and arriving in Tampa more passengers got off the train.....but another 120 got on. For all of our bellyaching (as enthusiasts or purists or whatever) about the Silver Star's Tampa turnaround, it is a schedule pattern that is helping Amtrak put revenue passengers in the seats. The coaches didn't begin to empty out until we arrived in West Palm Beach. One note - A mom and dad boarded with their two kids for a 'joyride' in Lakeland. They made the roundtrip to Tampa and hopped off about 90 minutes later when the train passed back through Lakeland.
Timekeeping - on-time or early at every station EXCEPT for making a 5-minute late departure from Tampa. In fact - as the stations from West Palm Beach southward are 'discharge passengers' only, we departed West Palm Beach 8 minutes ahead of schedule and flew down the line gaining time at each stop. We were almost 30 minutes ahead of the advertised by Hollywood. They were clearly doing this to get ahead and stay ahead of an 'all-stops' Tri-Rail commuter train. My guess is that the extra time in the Silver Star's schedule is needed on weekdays when there are far more commuter trains to work around. The trackwork which has taken place in south Florida since the advent of Tri-Rail is stunning. It was never this fast or this smooth when I was riding trains here 20-30 years ago.
The stations - I kind of miss the small SAL stations which used to scream 1930's and some do still retain that charm. The one's in Tri-Rail territory are still there......but surrounded by concrete, overhead crosswalks, and elevators. Yes, I know, it is the price of progress.
On the train - The GOOD - Serving crew in the diner (Chef, LSA, one waiter) and in the lounge car were all tremendous, pleasant, service oriented individuals. I was one of six people having lunch at the 11:45am call. The cheeseburger was better than some I've had on Amtrak, not as good as some others. At first I thought that the issue was coach passengers feeling unwelcome in the diner even though my cheeseburger lunch was about the same as I would have paid for the same sandwich and chips in the lounge. Not to worry - the horde of passengers boarding in Tampa filled a couple more seatings for lunch in the diner as we made our way south.
The bad - The equipment is getting threadbare and shabby. After running through the night from New York the coaches can become a little messy...particularly if you have a car attendant who would rather hang out in the lounge flirting with the cafe attendant. To be honest, our guy did pass through giving things a lick and a promise.....it wasn't as if he completely fell off the face of the earth......just that his coaches could have gotten a wee bit more attention.
The ugly - the aroma of the accessible bathroom in our coach. Those retention tanks get ripe in the south Florida heat.......after having been on the road for 28 hours already. The sign encourages you to clean up after yourselves BUT seeing as how the paper towel dispenser was empty......from at least my first visit at 11:30am.... the last 7 hours of the trip.....well....it was difficult to find the initiative to make much effort. The car attendant could have done a much better job here. He did appear with a mop inside the final 30 miles of the journey.
Lounge car - service was good and pleasant while open. Why must the lounge car close for good upon arrival in West Palm Beach? That's a full 90 - 120 minutes before arrival in Miami.
Final Observation - I cannot believe that I am still making long-distance Amtrak trips in Amfleet II Coaches (these are what....nearly 30 years old now) and eating in Heritage Fleet diners which are nearing 60 years old. At no point in the 'good ole days' did any self-respecting railroad soldier on carrying passengers in equipment with this kind of age. The railroads either upgraded their equipment or got out of the passenger business altogether when they were able.
Exploring high-speed rail is fine. Talking about expanding the number of routes on which passenger trains operate is a worthwhile exercise....HOWEVER, the real litmus test of whether passenger trains fared well in this era is whether or not Amtrak comes out of the Obama-Biden era with new rolling stock either on the property or at least on the way. Without new equipment....and alot of it.....in the near future, Amtrak's ability to operate status quo is in serious jeopardy.
Add my voice to the long list of those saying "It's about the equipment now." That is Amtrak's greatest challenge I believe.
Tomorrow morning I plan a ride down to the Miami Airport and back on Tri-Rail and then will retrace yesterday's route back to Winter Park on #92..... I'll report on that if there is anything worth mentioning!
-------------------- David Pressley
Advocating for passenger trains since 1973!
Climbing toward 5,000 posts like the Southwest Chief ascending Raton Pass. Cautiously, not nearly as fast as in the old days, and hoping to avoid premature reroutes. Posts: 4203 | From: Western North Carolina | Registered: Feb 2004
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Thanks for the write-up on your trip! There is an article in the current issue of "Trains" magazine that talks about Amtrak either stepping up to the plate and doing something, or firing the current CEO. My feeling is that it doesn't matter who the CEO is...Amtrak will still be the Amtrak that we know and love/hate today.
At the annual TRAC meeting in Ventura, CA this weekend, one of the Amtrak talking heads made a promise about a "big announcement" after January 1st regarding new long-distance equipment (sleepers, coaches, diners). I know nothing beyond that statement. However, I will say that I have been to these pro-passenger rail events before, and Amtrak big-whigs ALWAYS promise the moon and the stars.......but by the next year, all of those words are forgotten. That's why I stopped going----it's just a dog and pony show (without the dog and pony).
Posts: 2355 | From: Pleasanton, CA | Registered: Apr 2007
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quote:Originally posted by sbalax: Great report, David! Thanks for filling those of us on the other coast in.
Frank in dark and cool SBA
It occurs to me that I have awkened this morning in 'the other Hollywood'.
It's a return of sorts given that I worked with a summer youth organization just a couple dozen blocks aways back in the mid-to-late 1980's. The last time I stepped off a train here, I arrived riding in the roomette of a classic 10 & 6 sleeper!
-------------------- David Pressley
Advocating for passenger trains since 1973!
Climbing toward 5,000 posts like the Southwest Chief ascending Raton Pass. Cautiously, not nearly as fast as in the old days, and hoping to avoid premature reroutes. Posts: 4203 | From: Western North Carolina | Registered: Feb 2004
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As always, I enjoyed the report, David. Very detailed, but it underscores the need for Amtrak to get new equipment, quickly, and figure out how to solve the problem of inconsistent on board service.
I'm still not sure about the need for the Star's Tampa routing, especially in view of the unappealing bathrooms. Perhaps additional servicing in Jacksonville might help, if not a Tampa connection originating there. Did you notice if many sleeping car passengers left in Tampa?
Posts: 2397 | From: Camden, SC | Registered: Mar 2006
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Sleeper ridership was very light south of Tampa with most first class passengers opting for the faster 'Silver Meteor'.
Of course the passenger in South Florida wishing to travel to, say, Denmark, SC or Columbia or Raleigh has no choice but to ride the extra couple of hours it takes to include Tampa.
My thinking is that it would be nice if one of the two New York-Miami trains spawned a separate section to Tampa from Jacksonville via Ocala AND then operate a separate day train on a Tampa - Miami roundtrip. Both the main-stem of the Star and Meteor could continue south at Auburndale and by-pass the 'Tampa Turn-around' this way.
Both of these options have existed in the Amtrak era and current ridership suggests that they would be supported if tried again.
Briefly - my return on #92 featured stunningly good on-time performance and coach occupancy in the 80% range. There were a few more empty seats but not many. Coach passengers were not offered the chance to make dinner reservations......at least not that I heard.
Posts: 4203 | From: Western North Carolina | Registered: Feb 2004
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At one time there was a Tampa - Miami day train under Amtrak. I believe state supported, but I cannot remember when or how long it lasted.
Posts: 2808 | From: Olive Branch MS | Registered: Nov 2002
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Mr. Harris, that was the Silver Palm, which did receive State funding. It started during 1983 and was gone by 1985. So much for Florida's only venture into funding intercity passenger service.
Consist was F-40 three A-II's and A-II Lounge, and for the two or three times I rode it, appeared "adequately' well used.
Posts: 9977 | From: Clarendon Hills, IL USA (BNSF Chicago Sub MP 18.71) | Registered: Apr 2002
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My thinking is that it would be nice if one of the two New York-Miami trains spawned a separate section to Tampa from Jacksonville via Ocala
Nice, but not likely for reasons stated earlier. The "S" line is for freight and freight only any more. Having lost its use for passenger service, it (like service east of NOLA) is not coming back. Sorry to be so pessimistic, but efforts should be concentrated on retaining what we've got now in terms of "two-a-day" rather than pipe dreams.
Posts: 1530 | From: Ocala, FL | Registered: Dec 2006
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I'm sure any regular readers of this board have gotten tired of my rants about "how it was" and how Amtrak has trashed the Florida service. I saw some recent NARP numbers indicating that, over the last 30 years, ridership on Amtrak Florida trains has fallen by about a third. No surprise there. Four coaches and two sleepers in the middle of peak season! Early in my career I worked with a courtly Southerner named Emory Waldrop, who had been a senior passenger dept. employee at SAL and moved into government affairs after Amtrak. Emory is probably doing 60 RPM in his grave about now.
Posts: 614 | From: Merchantville, NJ. USA | Registered: Aug 2000
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My thinking is that it would be nice if one of the two New York-Miami trains spawned a separate section to Tampa from Jacksonville via Ocala
Nice, but not likely for reasons stated earlier. The "S" line is for freight and freight only any more. Having lost its use for passenger service, it (like service east of NOLA) is not coming back. Sorry to be so pessimistic, but efforts should be concentrated on retaining what we've got now in terms of "two-a-day" rather than pipe dreams.
Fair enough - scratch Ocala BUT wouldn't it be nice if Tampa could be served via separate section rather than forcing a main-stem train to backtrack?
Wouldn't it also be nice if the two trains moved through in the neighborhood of 8 hours apart?
Yesterday there had apparantly been some delay to the southbound Star as #92 met #91 just north of Sebring (some 40 minutes late) and then met #97 in the very next siding.....running perhaps only 15 - 20 minutes behind #91.
Posts: 4203 | From: Western North Carolina | Registered: Feb 2004
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quote:Originally posted by notelvis: Fair enough - scratch Ocala BUT wouldn't it be nice if Tampa could be served via separate section rather than forcing a main-stem train to backtrack?
Wouldn't it also be nice if the two trains moved through in the neighborhood of 8 hours apart?
That sounds like something that could work in the future if and when Florida ever gets an intrastate train running along the I-4 corridor between say, Deland, Sanford, or Orlando and Tampa. Certainly, the two "Silver" trains are running too close together now, also.
No reason why both the Meteor and the Star couldn't both "connect" with a train to Tampa at one of the above stops.
Posts: 1530 | From: Ocala, FL | Registered: Dec 2006
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Based upon Mr. Presley's observations noted earlier in the topic, 91-92 loadings remain 'strong' into and out of Tampa. Possibly Amtrak Marketing should be given credit, for once in its life, for identifying the market and endeavoring to serve it with 'what they got".
Additional trains to or within Florida? not out of the Federal trough. Local? I think anyone who follows passenger railroad affairs within Florida knows the likelihood of that.
I think passenger railroading's interests are best served by having in place a train that serves the on-line population centers rather than avoiding them, regardless if circuitous but within the scope of reason, such a routing may be (read: Texas Eagle) . This the existing Silver Star does well. Lest we forget, the Meteor is the most vulnerable LD train on the System to seeing an Adios drumhead, as it could be whacked without any 180 Day Notice under ARAA '97. Sooner or later, such as when the economy recovers, the Obama administration will 'get a little old-time religion" on fiscal responsibility; the edict will be out to cut ancillary programs - and few can argue Amtrak, especially LD Amtrak, is anything otherwise. Like it or not, a train that could be whacked without Notice (account other service - The Palmetto - over the A-Line) is certainly more expedient to have on the chopping block than one for which such Notice is required.
There is always that chance that some party is going to progress the matter in the Judicial system that Sunset East was discontinued without Notice - and even a chance they will prevail resulting in restoration of the service. Even the most staunch advocate must accept that train will not return under Amtrak's own volition.
Posts: 9977 | From: Clarendon Hills, IL USA (BNSF Chicago Sub MP 18.71) | Registered: Apr 2002
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quote:Originally posted by Gilbert B Norman: Based upon Mr. Presley's observations noted earlier in the topic, 91-92 loadings remain 'strong' into and out of Tampa. Possibly Amtrak Marketing should be given credit, for once in its life, for identifying the market and endeavoring to serve it with 'what they got".
Yes.....loadings into and out of Tampa were strong both days and in both directions. I had expected perhaps 40 or 50 passengers max off and on......actual totals were better than twice that.
-------------------- David Pressley
Advocating for passenger trains since 1973!
Climbing toward 5,000 posts like the Southwest Chief ascending Raton Pass. Cautiously, not nearly as fast as in the old days, and hoping to avoid premature reroutes. Posts: 4203 | From: Western North Carolina | Registered: Feb 2004
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Thanks for the report, David. As always, it was detailed and informative. I expect to be taking the train all the way to FL at least once this winter again, though I will use sleepers for most of it. But I am hoping to make an overnight stop in Winter Park and perhaps take that dreaded bus to Tallahassee at least . . . just can't keep waiting for the Sunset Ltd to resume! Do you have any restaurant recs in Winter Park down near the train (i.e., without a car)?
Posts: 2642 | From: upstate New York | Registered: Mar 2004
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Ms. Sojourner, I'm certain RRRICH can be more specific with restaurant recommendations (the one we went to last March was Cafe d' France), but there is "restaurant row' within sight of the Station at Winter Patk.
While there are no national brand hotels within Winter Park, there is the Park Plaza hotel also within sight of the station. To me it looked "attractive" (I stayed at a Courtyard in Maitland, but I had my own auto).
One final word regarding Winter Park; "smell the money". I think that should suffice on that point.
Posts: 9977 | From: Clarendon Hills, IL USA (BNSF Chicago Sub MP 18.71) | Registered: Apr 2002
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I concur to seek RRRich for suggestions. He lives near Winter Park and often railfans there. I would not be surprised if there are some possibilities within a couple or three blocks of the station.
I do know that there is a 'shopping area' some 10-14 blocks away that contains many of the acceptable chain restaurants such as Olive Garden and Cheesecake Factory among others. This area is accessable from the train station via the local transit system buses....the 'Lynx'
-------------------- David Pressley
Advocating for passenger trains since 1973!
Climbing toward 5,000 posts like the Southwest Chief ascending Raton Pass. Cautiously, not nearly as fast as in the old days, and hoping to avoid premature reroutes. Posts: 4203 | From: Western North Carolina | Registered: Feb 2004
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Hi folks -- yes there are several nice restaurants on Park Avenue within a few blocks of the WPK AMTRAK station. Just cross the park in front of the station, and walk either north or south a couple blocks and you'll find some nice places. The Cafe de France that Mr. Norman suggests is several blocks south of the station area, and it is "high end" but very nice. The "shopping area" 10-14 blcoks away that Mr. Pressley mentions is the Winter Park Village Shopping Complex. It would be a moderate walk from AMTRAK west several blocks, or you could take a taxi there. (or the Lynx bus as David suggests, but I don't know their schedule -- see www.golynx.com)Posts: 2428 | From: Grayling, MI | Registered: Mar 2002
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quote:Originally posted by RRRICH: Hi folks -- yes there are several nice restaurants on Park Avenue within a few blocks of the WPK AMTRAK station. Just cross the park in front of the station, and walk either north or south a couple blocks and you'll find some nice places. The Cafe de France that Mr. Norman suggests is several blocks south of the station area, and it is "high end" but very nice. The "shopping area" 10-14 blcoks away that Mr. Pressley mentions is the Winter Park Village Shopping Complex. It would be a moderate walk from AMTRAK west several blocks, or you could take a taxi there. (or the Lynx bus as David suggests, but I don't know their schedule -- see www.golynx.com)
Thanks Rich....
I've since 'Google Earthed' Winter Park and noted that Winter Park Village is nearer to Amtrak than I realized.
My only defense is that usually in Winter Park I am riding rather than driving. I will say that Winter Park with the park adjacent offers perhaps the most attractive neighborhood surrounding an Amtrak station anywhere in the United States.
-------------------- David Pressley
Advocating for passenger trains since 1973!
Climbing toward 5,000 posts like the Southwest Chief ascending Raton Pass. Cautiously, not nearly as fast as in the old days, and hoping to avoid premature reroutes. Posts: 4203 | From: Western North Carolina | Registered: Feb 2004
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Yes, I concur -- the park and neighborhood surrounding the WPK AMTRAK station is very nice indeed -- if you take a good sniff, you can "smell the money!"
Posts: 2428 | From: Grayling, MI | Registered: Mar 2002
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