The passenger cars that Amtrak first started with were from the late 1930s to about the 1960s. Most of them lasted in regular revenue service until the 1970s and 1980s. They won't last forever, either.
The Superliners, Amfleets, and Viewliners will also not last forever. The relative age of the fleet will be catching up to Amtrak. Many of the Amfleets are nearing 30 years age (and they are showing it), with the first batch of Superliners not far behind. These cars will require more maintenace and TLC as they age in order to keep them in service. Also keep in mind that the mechanical skills and people won't be around forever, either. People retire, or occupations cease to exist due to technology, or people take a new job somewhere else. Any way it happens, the ability to fix a car with a certain skill is lost. Amtrak either trains a replacement worker, or adopts new techniques for maintaining the cars.
My point being that Amtrak will be at its most vulnerable to termination right when the replacement of the cars currently in service has to take place. The purchase of replacement equipment will be a major "big bucks" budget item for Amtrak, and our Congress members may balk at having to pay for the new fleet. The lack of a large domestic car builder car supplier will also serve as an impediment, as this means little to no "pork-barrel" incentive for certain lawmakers.
Other members of the Forum may have other thoughts on this. Can the purchase of replacements for the current Amtrak fleet be done without it becoming more political than the issues surrounding Amtrak already are?
[This message has been edited by CG96 (edited 02-03-2004).]
There is hope in some bills working their way through Congress, which would authorize up to $2 billion per year in rail related capital expenses. States and Amtrak would be eligible for these funds, assuming one or the other of these bills passes. It may not happen this year, but there's still time, and I think more members of Congress are slowly starting to "get it." People like John McCain are starting to lose influence over Amtrak.
That's my two cents, anyway.
And if they ever design a Superliner III, I sure hope they make larger rest rooms!
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Trust God, love your neighbor, and never mistake opinion for truth.
-Mr. Toy
But the Viewliners I've traveled in? They're already beginning to rattle apart -- even though, in "railroad years," they're practically brand new.
Whether you're talking about automobiles, washing machines, TV sets, or railroad cars, the concept of building something to last really disappeared during the Eisenhower administration. They just don't make 'em the way they used to. And I agree that it's probably going to create major budget problems for Amtrak somewhere down the line.
Also, would it be nice to have a thrid design out on the Rails?
Congressional Office of Technology Assessment, even in the 80s, looked at economics of US passenger railcar industry. When and if we re-capitalize, it will be a challenge to do it onshore. Period.
Rader/Colorado will need to get to a 200 car per year level of effort to sustain fleet replacement on a ten year cycle. BTW, they work in Cor-Ten (TM), not stainless.
Again, from the Congressional report: Design life of a railcar is 15 years, with a 100% life extension if the car is rebuilt.
I honestly think the politics and timing of a recapitalization effort will be the toughest part of this problem. If, indeed, a key COngressional (read pork) question is domestic jobs as a consequence of the effort, Amtrak will be in political trouble.
As far as Budd or Pullman going back into business, forget it. Budd is long since a member of Thyssen AG of Germany, and they are OUT of the car business. Heck, most of their production in their corporate name is small auto parts. I'm not even sure you can find who owns the estate of Pullman-Standard anymore, without a liability attorney.
My two cents.
John
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The City of Saint Louis (UP, 1967) is still my standard for passenger operations
[This message has been edited by PullmanCo (edited 02-05-2004).]
quote:
Originally posted by 20th Century:
p.s. seems to me it would have been much better if Amtrak could have found a way to install retention toilets and showers in the 50's streamliner sleepers and do the same with retention toilets in the 50's coaches....at least for eastern states travel. Does anyone know if they considered that?
i'd be more inclined to gto with the toilet type that the old cars had. It seems to me that the retention toilets clog up and freeze shut so often during the winter that it makes more sense to go back to the old style toilets. I recall something to the effect that Amtrak was taken to court, and won the case to keep the old style, drain-right-to-the-tracks type of facilities. Does anyone recall the particulars about why Amtrak changed its corporate mind as to why the chioce was made to install these more troublesome toilets when the existing methods and facilities were sufficient?
[This message has been edited by CG96 (edited 02-06-2004).]