Via Rail has announced that the Toronto to Montreal overnight Enterprise will cease operations as of the 15th of September 2005. As has been reported elsewhere, Via is saying that the loads have been insufficient to warrant keeping this train. Most disappointing given the fact that I use this train fairly frequently on trips to Montreal. Perhaps I can drown my sorrows with an extra shot of gin next time I travel Via 1.
Posted by Gilbert B Norman (Member # 1541) on :
The Cavalier was my last (didn't say final) ride aboard VIA, when during July 1980 (after the NRHS Convention) I rode it Toronto-Montreal.
"It was a ride'; nothing to remember favorable or otherwise. I got my sleep (or at least enough) and VIA got their fare. Even at that time, it was only two Sleepers - Montreal and Ottawa each.
Simply one more of these "how did it survive so long?" stories. Same applies for "The Federal' on Amtrak.
Folks, simply because "WE" would be happy to travel an overnighter to destination for business, the average business traveler does not.
RIP Cavalier/Enterprise, Federal, Lark, Pittsburger, Golden Triangle, City of Chicago......!!!!
"Cavalier's last hurrah" was likely 1967 - the year of the Expo. I rode it during that era, and I can recall as it approached Montreal Gare Centrale, looking both forward and rear, and seeing "Sleepers stretching out of sight".
That incidentally was the last hurrah for the entire Canadian National passenger service initiative. If they couldn't "make it' during Expo, they were never going to make it. They "threw in the towel" shortly thereafter.
Posted by ds555 (Member # 3785) on :
Let's not sell the Federal (now simply trains 66 and 67, and now running Boston-Washington-Newport News and vice versa) too short: It still exists in altered form, but has lost its sleeping cars because of Amtrak's shortage of operable Viewliners. There's no decisive reason to think that trains 66 and 67 would be devoid of sleeping cars today if Amtrak had enough of them on hand. In the last few years, when the consists only included one sleeping car, that lone car frequently sold out: there really should have been two of them in the consists, but the inadequate size of Amtrak's Viewliner order had made that impossible.
I continue to hold out hope that, if Amtrak survives, the sleeping cars will eventually return to Boston-Washington overnight service. For that matter, trains 190 and 150, departing Washington for Boston at 3 a.m., need sleeping cars too; and they need counterpart southbound trains leaving Boston at 3 a.m. to return those sleeping cars to Washington.
Posted by North American Railroader (Member # 3398) on :
The one thing I found odd with the Enterprise was how it had a dome car, even though its service was late at night. I did find it useful though. I you wanted to spend the whole day in Montreal or Toronto, then you could catch the Enterprise at night. However, I can see why they cut it, the destinations were too close.
Posted by jp1822 (Member # 2596) on :
I think VIA should substitute it for a late evening train between the two cities (Montreal and Toronto), as a replacement to the overnight Enterprise. Arriving at midnight in Montreal/Toronto the latest. Perhaps some re-arranging of the corridor schedule could take place now, as VIA has been doing between other corridor points.
I too am sorry to see the Enterprise go. I had travelled on it a few times, as I opted to fly or take the train to Montreal from NY City and then Enterprise (hotel on wheels) to Toronto in order to catch the Canadian. I always heard mixed reports on patronage. It was pretty well filled when I rode it. And it was one of the smoothest overnight trains in a sleeper I have ever been on - much smoother than the former Amtrak Twilight Shoreliner turned Federal.
Frankly, the Renaissance sleepers fitted the Enterprise well. I couldn't imagine being couped up in the Renaissance sleeper on the VIA's Ocean between Montreal and Halifax. It's nice they are adding a Park Car and special class in the off season, but the Renaissance Lounge cars need to be overhauled to allow better seating and comfortability if they are to replace the Budd domes/lounge on the Ocean.
Posted by Pojon (Member # 3080) on :
When I lived in Port Perry, Ontario, Niagara Falls and in the Toronto area I used the enterprise many times to Montreal and I will miss it! When I moved back to Florida I lamented not being close to VIA trains which I always enjoyed. I miss all those routes which had service which now do not and I miss the old frequency on many routes which the government in Ottawa killed. There was even a route from Toronto's Union Station to Myrtle (near Port Perry) in the pre-GO-train commuter train routes. Lots of routes are gone today like in northern Quebec (Senneterre) and other routes to Nova Scotia via the U. S. in northern and central Maine--which was a delightful route.
Posted by royaltrain (Member # 622) on :
I also remember the overnight trains from Toronto to Ottawa, Toronto to Kapuskasing, Toronto to Chicago and New York and Montreal to New York. I rode all of those trains at various times in the past 30 + years, and all served an important segment of the travelling public. I believe the Enterprise may be the last overnight train in North America with sleeping cars that serve city pairs in the 300-500 mile range. A great loss. In any event, for memory's sake of this important rail service, I'm going to try to be on the last run from Montreal on the 14th of September.
Posted by CN 6060 Fan (Member # 3093) on :
quote:Originally posted by jp1822: I think VIA should substitute it for a late evening train between the two cities (Montreal and Toronto), as a replacement to the overnight Enterprise. Arriving at midnight in Montreal/Toronto the latest.
Frankly, the Renaissance sleepers fitted the Enterprise well. I couldn't imagine being couped up in the Renaissance sleeper on the VIA's Ocean between Montreal and Halifax.
VIA has always provided an evening service. Train #68 departs Toronto at 6:35pm and arrives in Montreal at 11:55pm. Train #69 departs Montreal at 6:15pm and arrives Toronto at 11:34pm. And when the Enterprise is discontinued there will also be an additional new evening train departing Toronto at 10pm and arriving in Kingston at 1am. The morning train from Kingston to Toronto keeps the same schedule as the Enterprise.
The Renaissance equipment is also a perfect fit for the Ocean. The majority of the traffic is from Moncton, northern New Brunswick and eastern Quebec into Montreal. Which is also a quick overnight journey: Depart Moncton around 6pm and into Montreal at 8am. Eastbound: depart Montreal at 7pm and into Moncton at 11am.
VIA has now addressed the longer haul Tourist traffic to/from Halifax by adding a new Easterly Class, complete with a Park Car attached to the rear of the Renaissance consist. VIA has improved the lounge seating in the Ren lounges. And the square/foot area of a Ren bedroom is almost identical to that of a Budd bedroom. The Budd just seams a bit larger because it has chairs when the bed is raised. Ren’s have a couch. And if you would normally book a Roomette on a Budd Ocean, you get a Bedroom to yourself on a Ren Ocean for only a slight increase in the fare: But a Huge difference in space!
Posted by CN 6060 Fan (Member # 3093) on :
quote:Originally posted by Pojon: Lots of routes are gone today like in northern Quebec (Senneterre)
It's still operated by VIA and a lot more popular as it's now a daytime run. A combined train leaves Montreal in the morning. At Hervey Jct. the train splits into sections for Senneterre and Jonquiere arriving in the evening. The following day the trains return, combining at Hervey Jct for the run into Montreal.
When I rode in summer 2002, a group had chartered a Park Car. What a great way to view lakes and mountains of northern Quebec!