In the current issue of 'Trains' magazine, there is an article on the new order. Some of the main points:
The interiors of sleepers are modular in design with tight tolerances. The goal is to eliminate all those squeaks and rattles as well as insure all light is blocked at night.
Baggage cars have expandable and folding racks for luggage and bikes.
The sleeper was referred to as a 10-2-1 design (a reference to Pullmans' ubiquitous 10sec-2cpt-1DR heavyweight cars). For the viewliners that means 10 roomettes (including one dedicated to the attendant), 2 BR, and the handicapped room - that is larger. This represents a loss of two roomettes, presumably for additional toilets that are now at the end of the car - and no longer in the room.
The dining car will "have wood grain interior, soothing colors,plus glass like dividers between tables' and direct and indirect lighting. The cars have 'more of a restaurant feel'.
No mention of the dorm space. While the sleeper will have less revenue space, I guess moving the crew members that now use a sleeper to the dorm will make up for this.
Equipment underneath each car will be shrouded and pressurized to prevent snow and dust damage.
I am a bit surprised that there were not fewer roomettes in the design and more of the popular bedrooms.
Posted by Gilbert B Norman (Member # 1541) on :
From Holiday Inn Express The Villages FL--
Oh Oh, I hope the showers will not be a casualty; I can hear it now "you're only on for one night; you can do without".
I just may have taken my final LD journey should that come to pass.
Finally, I can only presume that Amtrak has done adequate research regarding the car's configuaration, however, like Mr. Plmland, I Am surprised; I thought 8BR 4RM Attendant Shower (no handicapped room; you only need one per train) would have been the configuration.
Posted by palmland (Member # 4344) on :
Rest easy, GBN..."In addition the cars will offer a large dressing room and shower."
Have a good journey on AT and give us a report on the pine trees.
Posted by Ocala Mike (Member # 4657) on :
Met up with GBN for lunch today in Belleview, FL (about an hour or so NW of Sanford). Wished him a nice trip on the AT, and awaiting his report when he arrives in Chicagoland.
Posted by notelvis (Member # 3071) on :
I know that decisions are driven more by politics and economics, but I firmly believe that the solution to increasing Bedroom space (while enhancing the long-distance rail travel experience for premium passengers) would have been a Viewliner Sleeper offering 6 bedrooms on one end and a first class lounge (a la the famed Seaboard 'Sun Lounge' cars) on the other.
Add one of these cars to the standard consist in use on most single-level trains and you've essentially doubled the available bedroom space on each train.
Posted by palmland (Member # 4344) on :
Great idea, David. And I suppose it would be relatively easy to accomplish with the modular design. Perhaps the SCA could also tend bar - as was done in the original sleeper lounges.
Perhaps they could be named in the '--Beach' series like the Seaboard's. A quick check of fares for next week shows that a Bedroom on the Meteor will set you back $1071. I would think $6K per trip plus bar revenue would certainly cover its operating costs.
Posted by notelvis (Member # 3071) on :
Been years since I've paid cash for sleeping car space on an Amtrak train..... though I do manage a sleeper trip using AGR Points about once every 8 months on average.
Two trips back - July 2011 a bedroom PDX-LAX on the Coast Starlight.
Last One - a roomette ATL-NYP on the Crescent in November, 2011
Next up - a Family Bedroom on the Southwest Chief ABQ-CHI in July, 2012.
Got 'points in the bank' for the one after that!
Posted by sbalax (Member # 2801) on :
Will the bedrooms and the handicapped room still have toilets/sinks?
The cabins on most cruise ships are also modules. I can attest to the fact that that doesn't eliminate squeaks and noises!
Frank in sunny but cooling SBA
Posted by SilverStar092 (Member # 2652) on :
I'm pretty sure the existing Viewliners use a modular design. If you look closely, there is a big hatch on the side of the car where rooms can be inserted. The new design will cause problems as it will be impossible for Amtrak to ensure the use of a Viewliner I or a Viewiner II for a particular car line. Using a II instead of a I will leave some passengers with no room.
Posted by PullmanCo (Member # 1138) on :
Back to the Future.
The historic Pullman Company Plan 3585 cars (10 Section, 1 Drawing Room, 2 Compartment) have a footprint that sounds very much like these new viewliners.
These were the LAKE series HW cars...
Since Viewliners, like many modern LW cars, have only one set of loading doors, the exception would be the space on a HW devoted to the B end doors could be reallocated against the mens/womens lavs/showers...
Otherwise, care to bet the final design will look a bit like:
[ 10-28-2013, 08:55 AM: Message edited by: Admin5 ]
Posted by palmland (Member # 4344) on :
Frank, the report says only that no toilets in the roomettes. I'm pretty sure no change in the ones now in bedrooms or HC room.
I believe I'll take a room on a Lake car any day over the Viewliner, even without a shower. I don't expect the new viewliner communal restrooms will be anything as large as the ones shown here. I guess the closest we can come now is a bedroom on Dover Harbor (outside of PV/office cars).
Posted by PullmanCo (Member # 1138) on :
Speaking of DOVER HARBOR:
[ 10-28-2013, 08:55 AM: Message edited by: Admin5 ]
Posted by Gilbert B Norman (Member # 1541) on :
quote:Originally posted by Ocala Mike: Met up with GBN for lunch today in Belleview, FL (about an hour or so NW of Sanford). Wished him a nice trip on the AT, and awaiting his report when he arrives in Chicagoland.
From Holiday Inn West; Akron OH--
Mike, you should be pleased to know I told "Lady Lex" (the GPS Sat/Nav) "you're fired". She wanted to take me to Sanford on first I-75 thence Turnpike to I-4.
I would have done it had I had balance in my SunPass for such, but I didn't, so I took your routing starting with SR42, thence US 441 to SR 46. Got there at 230P.
All told in a word, 52(29) upheld my "more positives than negatives". Beef Tournedos at Dinner were "super" as were table companions. "LOR arrival was 1000A, and "Lex Noir" was one of the first off. In fact I was talking with some people I had met, did not hear the loading # called, but I did hear "Black Lexus with Illinois plates". They said it was about fifth off and was sitting there waiting on me for fifteen minutes. I showed the lovely girl - a loading supervisor my "booby prize" - a sunscreen - from being last unloaded on about Voyage 15.
AT is a great service, but I really think the only possible markets beyond LOR-SFA would be adding carriers to #3 Galesburg-La Junta and #5 Galesburg-Irondale CO. Remember, the AT clientele are simply not hobby travelers and definitely not railfans. Again I note, I wish more here had occasion to try out AT. (Yes, even though I've lived in Chicago for forty years, I know I'm really a New Yorker at heart).
Addendum, Feb 2; now that all usage has been reported at my SunPass account, there is a balance remaining of $2.90. Therefore I would have had adequate balance to take "Lady Lex's" suggested route via the TP ($2.00 toll). However, I got to SFA with time to spare and I got to see Eustis, Mt. Dora, and Sorrento - localities that not too many sonwbird tourists see the likes of.
Posted by The Chief (Member # 2172) on :
"The final assembly building is where workers will install the electrical wiring, upholstered seating, beds, and cooking and dining facilities. The completed cars will then be attached to the wheel assemblies, which are provided by an outside vendor."
Posted by Ocala Mike (Member # 4657) on :
Gil, when I left you I started thinking about your GPS routing you via I-75 and the Turnpike. I guess it's programmed for the FASTEST, not the SHORTEST, way (and not the CHEAPEST way either). Glad my "triptik" (remember those from AAA days?) was useful for you, and glad you had a good trip on the AT.
Posted by Gilbert B Norman (Member # 1541) on :
Now that exterior photos of the CAF cars are in the public domain, it appears that such will be quite similar, and possibly even identical to the existing Viewliners. Maybe, there will be no need for a new fleet name other than V-II's. While the interior configuration as we have noted will be different and taking that of a historic Pullman, 10-1-2, there are reports the existing Viewliners will be reconfigured to this 10-1-2 AND that undercarriage components such as HVAC will also be standardized with that of these CAF cars abuilding.
It appears that someone, maybe even within Amtrak, simply laid down the law and decreed "take 'em or leave 'em" avoiding any of the pervasive "design by committee' mentality with the Superliners, furthered by the "who's on first?" culture of 955 Elephant, 400 N Cap, and 60 Mass, as well as likely same today. "Take 'em or leave 'em" prevailed with Budd and the Amfleets; wonder why they are hands down the most successful equipment order Amtrak has made to date? Also wonder why they were in revenue service within two years of placing the order - and let alone thirty seven years thereafter?
Posted by PullmanCo (Member # 1138) on :
Gee. Fleet standardization. What a novel concept...
Developed by...
Posted by notelvis (Member # 3071) on :
GBN -
Mt. Dora has been the home to several erstwhile tourist train operations...... one an interesting Doodlebug. Even now, a small steam locomotive and three antique coaches makes a 16-mile roundtrip out of nearby Tavares on weekends...... something that I sampled just a couple of months ago.
Posted by Gilbert B Norman (Member # 1541) on :
Noted, Mr. Presley--
At Mt. Dora, I observed a "historic" downtown district as well as railroad tracks. But alas, my "focus' was on driving as well as the need to "maintain schedule".
Posted by Ocala Mike (Member # 4657) on :
notelvis - Under what name is that new tourist operation down there? Back around '07, they ran an excursion train from Eustis to Orlando and back, but I thought they went bust. Do they have a website?
Posted by notelvis (Member # 3071) on :
Mike,
The operation that you are thinking of did go bust.
This latest one, billing itself as the 'Orange Blossom Cannonball' just launched this past October.
The 2-6-0 locomotive has quite the resume and is currently lettered 'Tavares, Eustis, & Gulf'.
Thanks for that link, David. My son's family is coming to visit us from Salt Lake City in a couple of weekends, and my 3-1/2 year old grandson is a train buff already. Maybe we'll go down there that weekend.
Posted by Gilbert B Norman (Member # 1541) on :
Now that a 10RM-1SP-2BR + Att & Shower configuration has been announced, as well as plans to reconfigure the existing 50 car fleet (hopefully 52 with a return to revenue service of prototypes 2400-01), one has to wonder how much NET additional space Amtrak is gaining?
Let's first address Roomettes and lets ASSUME (let's can the jokes regarding that term; remember I've been Service and I've heard 'em before) that six Roomettes per train are presently reserved for Dining Car crew; also let's assume that the entire 50 car fleet is needed to support the existing assignments. The loss of two Roomettes per car for presumably four communal potties represents (50 X 2 = 150) a loss of 100 rooms for the existing fleet. The 25 Dorms added will enable 150 rooms to be released, and the 25 new cars with 10 each means 250 additional rooms; or a NET gain of 300 Roomettes. Since only seventeen sets are in service, with eight sets "resting', this means 170 more Roomettes are available systemwide each day.
No question there is a net gain of 50 rooms (25 X 2) for the fleet, or 34 (17 X 2) per day; also 25 or 17 Special rooms.
Now where I must question Amtrak's reasoning is with regards to Special Rooms (I think Handicapped is a now a non-term). I would think that the new cars should have been 10RM-4BR (assuming the SP represents 2BR) and that twenty existing cars be reconfigured same (the LSL will need two SP in each set). I realize this is a "touchy' with a publicly funded agency (and possibly even with some Members here), but it is my understanding that only one SP per train is required and that can be released for general sale 24 hrs prior to departure if not booked by a qualifying party. It was one thing to have standardization when there were only fifty cars, but with more and with only Card and Bos LS having a single car, should not this decision be reviewed?
Posted by notelvis (Member # 3071) on :
I agree that perhaps the final plan for thes cars should have perhaps increased the number of available bedrooms (as opposed to roomettes) by a greater margin.
I am hopeful that the new Viewliners will mean one additional sleeper on every train currently operating with Viewliners.
Imagine, two sleepers on the Cardinal and Boston section of the Lake Shore. Three or four sleepers on each departure for Florida. Three sleepers on the Crescent...... though maybe with one or two of them being short-turned in Birmingham as ridership dictates.
*Yes - Atlanta might make more sense for turning back part of the Crescent HOWEVER the track capacity for holding a handful of passenger cars over out of the way of freight traffic still exists at the Birmingham station - it does not in Atlanta.
Maybe even this means the return of a Washington-Boston sleeper line.
Posted by palmland (Member # 4344) on :
Trains.com reported Amtrak has issued a news release on their major projects for 2013. This includes new locomotives, bridge work on the NEC and the new Viewliner cars.
In Trains' report their version of the new Viewliner orders was:
New cars: Late 2013 will see the delivery of the first four of eight test cars of a $298.1 million order for 130 new single-level long-distance cars, including 25 sleepers, 25 diners, 55 baggage cars, and 25 baggage/dormitory cars. The first units will be placed in service late spring 2014. They are being built by CAF USA at a facility in Elmira, N.Y.
Posted by notelvis (Member # 3071) on :
Saw somewhere else that the diners would be coming first but that may have just been someone's conjecture.
Posted by PullmanCo (Member # 1138) on :
Gad. The order-ship time for passenger equipment is slower now than it was at the end of WWII, when everyone was streamlining as fast as they could.
Posted by palmland (Member # 4344) on :
If the diners are first, David, it must be because the heritage ones are now a maintenance nightmare. Otherwise I would think they would go for revenue producing sleepers first.
Posted by George Harris (Member # 2077) on :
quote:Originally posted by palmland: If the diners are first, David, it must be because the heritage ones are now a maintenance nightmare. Otherwise I would think they would go for revenue producing sleepers first.
Consider that the basic body shells of the current diners were built 60 plus years ago would be the same as for those of us that began riding trains in the 1960's getting in a car built in 1900!!! At that time, the 1920's built cars were regarded as between old and flat out ancient. Subtract 40 from now and you get cars built in the 1970's. There is not even any thought of replacing cars of that vintage.
Posted by Vincent206 (Member # 15447) on :
quote:Gad. The order-ship time for passenger equipment is slower now than it was at the end of WWII, when everyone was streamlining as fast as they could.
Try ordering a Boeing Dreamliner if you want to see slow delivery.
Posted by Gilbert B Norman (Member # 1541) on :
While the source of this material may be one frequented by Dr. Goebbels and Baghdad Bob, there is nevertheless a photo of a Diner well under construction. This would appear to confirm that Mr. Presley learned that the Diners will be the first cars to be delivered.
Considering that the youngest 85XX Heritage Diner in now 53 years old (NP; 1959) and the oldest 65 (NYC 1947), as well as the multitude of "things to go wrong" with Diners, as distinct from Baggage Cars, it is no wonder that they will be first off the line.
Finally, where has anyone seen from an official source that these cars will be fleet-named Viewliner?
Posted by Henry Kisor (Member # 4776) on :
PR Newswire has been around for ages. It's just a clearing house and transmission center for corporate press releases and product photographs. It was once carried on a variety of business trunk wires (AP and Reuters included), and is now a website. Just about every newspaper financial section has been or is a customer. I believe the Times and the Wall Street Journal still are.
Posted by Gilbert B Norman (Member # 1541) on :
Amtrak has released a video showing production of the now officially named Viewliner II's. There apparently was some kind of media event at the CAF facility in Elmira today:
I trust all will note the cars liveried 'retro' in Phase III. According to a blog release, that is by intent, although the 'pointless arrow' will be replaced with 'three sheets to the wind':
quote:Amtrak" Amtrak moderator41 minutes agoWith the launch of our new single-level long distance equipment – the “Viewliner II”, Amtrak is also launching Amtrak America, a brand that will encompass all that is great about Amtrak’s long-haul trains, including those with sleeper class service. Amtrak’s route brands will continue, and this brand will make the conversation and overall service offerings clear to our customers and stakeholders. Amtrak America will utilize our Phase Three striping on the single-level long distance cars as a tribute to our heritage. The first cars released from production will also carry Amtrak’s heritage logo in honor of our past. Amtrak’s current logo will return on the standard production cars
Finally, entry into revenue service is now set for Summer 2014; stay tuned for 'revisions'.
Posted by Ocala Mike (Member # 4657) on :
Well, somebody (Joe Boardman) is still "excited" about Amtrak LD, at least in the east.
Posted by palmland (Member # 4344) on :
Other railfan sites are all excited about the return of the phase III paint scheme. But your quote, GBN, says the "the logo will return on the standard production cars". I would be surprised if the current paint scheme isn't also used rather than phase III - which to me does look outdated.
The interior of the cars in the video does seem quite attractive.
Posted by Gilbert B Norman (Member # 1541) on :
I would think that the use of Phase III is a 'hey look at our new cars' promotion; just as I believe same case with the Exhibit (fka Anniversary) Train.
Likely only a few will be so liveried; I doubt if Phase III will be applied to any of the Baggage Cars. Once the V-II's become 'simply another car', those liveried Phase III will be reliveried Phas IV.
Finally, my avoidance of the term 'paint' is intentional; Amtrak 'paint' is actually industrial decals.
Posted by palmland (Member # 4344) on :
Apparently the new baggage cars can't come soon enough. Saw the Silver Star in Ashland a couple days ago. It was quite a healthy consist with 5 coaches and 3 sleepers. But, the sleepers were still up front, unlike recent winters when they went to the rear to facilitate rotating the consist with the LSL for thawing in the southland. Also - no baggage car. Instead, ahead of the first sleeper was a deadheading coach presumably filled with suitcases!
Posted by SilverStar092 (Member # 2652) on :
That happened on my latest trip in October 2013. A peak into the Amfleet II coach revealed luggage piled atop seats. Slow loading via vestibule instead of directly via a big side door.
Posted by PullmanCo (Member # 1138) on :
Sometime look at the plans for a true baggage car: You'll find it has a reinforced underframe and more robust structure in the walls than a coach, diner, lounge, or sleeper. It's carrying relatively dense weight. Passengers really are just cube, and a lot of that cube is comfort space.
Posted by Gilbert B Norman (Member # 1541) on :
Regarding 'where in the world are the V-II's', there are now reports at other sites (to what extent credible, I know not) that as many as twenty cars will soon be released by CAF and will be gathered at Rensselaer for training and pre-acceptance testing.
There are further reports that five of the cars will be handled in a test train, along with an A-I and A-II, with an Amtrak locomotive from Elmira to Rensselaer to further expose the equipment to 'the real world'. If this be the case and the most direct ERIE-Bingo-D&H routing is used, this equipment (sigh, Mr. Mike Smith) will run through Oneonta, NY - often considered to be the cradle of organized labor.
Once again, all of this is hearsay - and not necessarily 'authoritative'. But if there is any foundation to such, it would appear that whatever production issues have delayed V-II deliveries have been resolved.
And finally, at the Illinois topic, while I made the comment that Nippon Shyaru, has certainly made a real commitment towards continued railcar building in Northern Illinois, CAF's commitment to Upstate NY cannot be overlooked. As the V-II's enter revenue service, one will quickly learn to what extent CAF is a responsible bidder. However, considering that intercity passenger trains are clearly here to stay, Amtrak or successor agency, could place orders for as many as 1000 cars over the next ten years and that 'buy American' guidelines are apparently met so long as cars are assembled and are rolled out from a US facility, there could well be a case of 'all hands on deck'.
Posted by palmland (Member # 4344) on :
I had heard that the first cars out would be baggage. If so, they certainly ought to be able to master the construction of those boxes on wheels. Regardless, I will be glad to finally see progress on this. Perhaps one or two might show up at the Streamliners at Spencer event late this month as Amtrak is supposed to have some sort of exhibit.
On your Madison adventure, GBN, I'm surprised you weren't tempted to avoid the traffic and take a joy ride to Milwaukee with rental car beyond.
Posted by Gilbert B Norman (Member # 1541) on :
Those same reports noted that a 'Viewchow' and a 'Viewsnooze' will be amongst the cars first released. However, it would certainly appear that 'Viewbags' will be first to see revenue service.
Oh and regarding Madison, Mr. Palmland's suggestion didn't even X my mind; even though the direct cost (forget about fully allocated) to run Red Lex up there and back was $172.21. Amtrak-MKE-Badger Bus? Hey, I'm from Chicago area; not 'Upstate NY'.
Posted by smitty195 (Member # 5102) on :
How do you know it cost $172.21 to get your car up there? Does a trip computer built into the car tell you that, or do you routinely document these things?
Posted by Gilbert B Norman (Member # 1541) on :
The latter; Smitty - and have been doing so long before there were any kind of on-board computers.
I have records for a 1971 AMC Hornet, as well as the thirteen vehicles that have followed, I once had while at the MILW (can't do anything that could be construed as 'showing off' when you work for a railroad).
Oh and finally, the girl I noted over at the 'Illinois' topic; her usual route except for school year start and end, is Mom's Acura SUV to O'Hare, then Van Galder bus (they also hold Thruway contracts with Amtrak) to Madison.
Posted by Gilbert B Norman (Member # 1541) on :
There is quite a video now posted at YouTube showing three Viewliners being delivered to Amtrak from the CAF plant:
I trust it is noted that one of each "personnel" cars are included. Added to the previously delivered Baggage car, there is now "one of each" on Amtrak property.
Posted by palmland (Member # 4344) on :
It is good to see all 4 car types are actually in production. You never know with Amtrak. I wonder if they will sell revenue space in the bag dorm. Thinking of the Cardinal with very OBS staff.
Saw the Crescent in Lynchburg the other nite. Right on time and appeared to be full. The Lynchburg trai was on its siding at the station with 9 cars. The city has built a very nice local transit facility across from the station, although Greyhound still uses it. Major road improvements there too
Posted by Vincent206 (Member # 15447) on :
I recently watched the National Geographic Channel's episode on the building of NYC subway cars. There are some differences between Amtrak's Viewliners and subway cars, but I'm sure that many of the manufacturing processes are similar. The building of the traction motors was particularly fascinating for me.
Posted by Geoff Mayo (Member # 153) on :
Vincent, I don't know how one procures a visit to Beech Grove (I was on an organized tour by the Institute of Railway Signal Engineers) but if you can, go for it. We saw traction motors in various stages of reconstruction there which was quite interesting.
Posted by Gilbert B Norman (Member # 1541) on :
There are reports from reliable sources elsewhere that Viewbags entered revenue service today. Reportedly, they will be "fed" into the consists of 20, Crescent, 79, Carolinian, 92, Star, and 98, Meteor. That would be 14 cars of the 30 reported to be on the property.
Posted by Gilbert B Norman (Member # 1541) on :
FINALLY---
Today I observed #5(6), Zephyr, with a V-Bag in consist. Now I've seen one "on the road".
With three PV's on the rear (Burrard, Promontory Point, and unknown) returning from their "pow-wow", Phase III on the head, and eight Supers in Ph IVb, there were definite allusions to the "Circus Trains" from "Pioneer Days".
Posted by Gilbert B Norman (Member # 1541) on :
Two of 'em, 61038 and 61053, are in consist of #5(8).
No sign of any in a #3 consist, nor of any heading Eastward.
Pretty soon the sighting of an H-Bag will become "unique".
Posted by PullmanCo (Member # 1138) on :
Lots of ooooohs and ahhhhs for a stainless steel LCL car....
;-)
Posted by Gilbert B Norman (Member # 1541) on :
I wonder if #4(16) will be a "railfan event"; it should be the last train with an H-Bag in revenue service.
Posted by Gilbert B Norman (Member # 1541) on :
This could be "over the top" and I will fully understand if Moderator Lori chooses to kill it, but there is a report at another site and attributed to an advocacy group that CAF has paid late delivery penalties to Amtrak in sufficient amounts so that they have no obligation to complete the V-II order,
If there is any foundation to this report, could this mean that the presently forty one undelivered cars (6 D,25 S,10 B) will remain just that? If CAF chooses to further deliver workmanlike cars, is Amtrak obligated to accept them?
Please note I have searched for an outside confirmation of the report, but unable to find such.
Posted by Gilbert B Norman (Member # 1541) on :
Are there any rumors regarding the "next Diner drop"?
Will 23 & 24 have a "normal delivery" by end of month?
09, 10, 11; any "leaks" regarding WHY these cars were "runaround"? Minor stuff or "big time", such as defective carbody fabrication?
Of interest, what will 00 look like when delivered. Will it be configured for full service Dining or will the food preparation area be modified for "Fresh and Contemporary" as well as some "Lounge Banquettes" replacing straight tables? Will a Conductor's office be carved out of the existing Kitchen area?
Finally gottawunder if Amtrak even cares if they get the final six. The nineteen of such on the property are sufficient to cover assignments to 19-20, Crescent, 48-49, Lake Shore, 97-98, Meteor, as well as provide for spares.
Posted by Gilbert B Norman (Member # 1541) on :
There are reports at several other sites that VII-D's are now in all consists of 448-449, Lake Shore, and that there are protect cars at each endpoint.
If such be the case, then the nineteen on the property are out there "earning their keep".
....Uh, well, if one considers using a car built as a full service Diner as a Table Car.
Posted by Gilbert B Norman (Member # 1541) on :
Reliable source reports at other sites that a pickup train is about to be on its way from Albany to Elmira and will return with 09,23,24 and one Bag-Dorm.
Down to the "final thirty seven" (9BD, 3D, 25S).
I would think there will then be enough Diners to assign them to 50-51, Cardinal. That would be two in sets and a protect at Wash. This would be a good "proving ground" to see if one Attendant can serve, Bar, Snacks, and Sleeper meals efficiently.
Oh, and how about giving cash free a real tryout.
Now when they get the last three and with 48-51 returning to Penn enabling release of the BOS and Wash protects, they would have sufficient cars to assign them to 91-92, Silver Star used in the same manner at outlined for 50-51. But again, if they plan to do one thing at One Mass today, somebody will have better meeting skills tomorrow and they end up doing something else.
Finally, I wouldn't expect that single Bag-Dorm to see much in the way of service "for a while".
Posted by palmland (Member # 4344) on :
It will be interesting to see how Anderson deploys the bag-dorms, GBN. I am still of the opinion that Amtrak should have stayed with the original order of 25 B-D simply because they generate more revenue (either directly or indirectly by freeing up sleeper space) than a full baggage car.
Supposedly one of the reasons for the change was to insure enough space to allow bikes on the train. I can see the need for bike space on corridor trains, but question the need on LD service requiring a full baggage car. This is especially so with the current elimination of baggage service at many of the stations that are losing their agent.
Posted by Gilbert B Norman (Member # 1541) on :
quote:Originally posted by palmland: It will be interesting to see how Anderson deploys the bag-dorms, GBN.
At this time, my guess is 19-20, Crescent, and 91-92, Silver Star.
Crescent will be five cars; four in consists, one protect at NOL. Star will also be five cars; one protect SSY, four in consists. With these assignments, all cars will make it in revenue service to HIA for periodics.
Assignment to 50-51, Cardinal, would give more "breathing room", as such would be only four cars. However, the "flip side" would be how to get the cars in revenue service, as distinct from deadhead, down to HIA?
Posted by palmland (Member # 4344) on :
I agree, GBN, that the Crescent is a prime candidate with a full service diner, two sleepers and the cafe lounge. Im not sure about the Star as it has a much reduced crew with no diner so, assuming the SCA uses the bag-dorm, only 4 of the 8 dorm rooms would be used.
Posted by palmland (Member # 4344) on :
The first bag-dorm, and 3 diners, were on the Meteor last night headed for Hialeah. 97 was about on time as it came through Ashland as viewed on the Ashland cam. How many years has this taken?
Presumable the roll out should be faster than the diners as it is arguably less complicated than the diner. CAF has had plenty of baggage car experience. And supposedly the roomettes/dorm rooms are on site ready to be inserted into the cars. No doubt CAF will make it easier said than done.
Posted by Gilbert B Norman (Member # 1541) on :
quote:Originally posted by palmland: Im not sure about the Star...only 4 of the 8 dorm rooms would be used.
Mr. Palmland, this would mean four available for revenue sale. Any one-time fables of "this is OUR car" are gone. The appointments will be equal to those in the revenue Sleeper. In slack periods, one full Sleeper could be cut, which is probably just as well as the two involved at Cayce have been assigned to the Legal Department - and who knows for how long before repairs can even begin. By then, there might even be some V-II-S on the property, and those V-I's will be the first to be rebuilt with the V-II configuration.
Posted by Gilbert B Norman (Member # 1541) on :
Thete are photos of two V-Diners, 10-Dover and 11-Frankfort en route from CAF to Amtrak. Only 00-Albany remains undelivered.
With the additional cars, maybe there can be assignments to 50-51, Cardinal, and 91-92, Star. However I'm not about to place my chips on the table over that occurring.
Posted by Gilbert B Norman (Member # 1541) on :
There are reports at other sites (reliable posters) that one Sleeper (and maybe the last Diner, 00-Albany) will be delivered "quite soon".
Obviously, one Sleeper represents nothing more than a "Tinker Toy" for the Mechanical folk.
Someday, this whole debacle, however it ends, will make for a most interesting B-School case study.
Posted by Gilbert B Norman (Member # 1541) on :
There are photos posted "elsewhere" showing 62502 - Rapidan River and 68000 - Albany, enroute from CAF to Albany.
Thirty three to go.
Posted by palmland (Member # 4344) on :
It appears then that Amtrak is running around the bag-dorms that were supposed to come next. I guess that makes sense since the existing baggage cars seems to take care of that need and a new sleeper is added revenue -less the 4 or 5 roomettes used for the crew (although I suspect they will bumped to a Viewliner I sleeper).
Interesting that Rapidan River is the first one. I saw the Southern's original Rapidan River many times, usually in Washington on the Southerner or Peach Queen. Since the Rapidan River crosses the NS north of Charlottesville,where I believe Wick Moorman now lives, I wonder if the naming of the first car was in his honor. But then, that would be out of character for Amtrak.
