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I think its time to stop the long distance routes
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by Mr. Toy: [QB] [QUOTE]Originally posted by polarbearucla: [b]To Mr. Toy I think you (and most of the memebers of this board) see the purpose of Amtrak quite differently then I do. I see the purpose of Amtrak being an efficent (time and money wise) TRANSPORTER of people. [/b][/QUOTE] I can't argue with that one bit. But I do argue with your conclusion that just because a train trip is pleasant, and not always on time, that it is therefore not relevant as transportation. I, as do many others on this board, do in fact use the trains for transportation. My aim is to get somewhere. The fact that I have fun along the way in no way changes the fact that it is both convenient and cost effective for my trips. The two concepts are not mutually exclusive. [QUOTE][b] Interestingly, it appears to me that most people are blind to the faults of Amtrak because of a passion for trains. [/b][/QUOTE] Hardly. I think everyone here is well aware of Amtrak's shortcomings. We've all been on late trains, and we've all encountered the occasional cranky employee, and other issues. But we are also keenly aware of Amtrak's POTENTIAL, if it were properly funded, and treated as an equal partner in our nation's transportation systems. We know, for example, that Amtrak's trains are quite capable of running on time, and at even faster speeds, if the tracks weren't overcrowded with freight traffic. That in turn is due to a lack of capital investment, not an inherent defficiency in train travel. [QUOTE][b] However, this passion for trains overshadows the fact that Amtrak does little in the way of fulfilling the role of a train (TRANSPORTING PEOPLE); [/b][/QUOTE] Tell that to the people who are traveling overnight in coach. They're doing it because it is cheap and reasonably comfortable, not for any "cruise" experience. [QUOTE][b] Thus I think that most posters are sadly failing to perceive and judge Amtrak by the correct standards.... However, many individuals on this board are judging Amtrak by how "fun" LD routes are. [/b][/QUOTE] I don't think that is the sole standard on this board for judging any train. It is the icing on the cake, not the cake itself. Right now I would not recommend the Sunset Limited to anyone, because it is having horrible troubles staying on time. Due to UP's latest meltdown, it is certainly not meeting my standards as a transportation service. Yet I will fight for its survival, because I believe it CAN be a reasonable mode of basic transportation, when (not if) UP gets its act together. [QUOTE][b] This mindset by posters and many riders pushes amtrak away from one day becoming a successful alternative to air travel and relegates it to competing with other forms of transportation entertainment. [/b][/QUOTE] I disagree. I think it is those, like you, who believe Amtrak is a cruise experience are making policymakers believe that as well, and they in turn are pushing Amtrak aside as irrlevant. We're not doing that here. I can't speak for everyone here, but I think the vast majority understand the benefits of rail transportation as transportation first, fun second. These benefits include superior energy efficiency, minimal environmental impact, and yes, comfort. It can't be everything for everyone, or for every trip, but neither can other modes. Its all about having alternatives that best meet the needs of the traveler. For many trips, Amtrak meets my needs better than flying or driving. Period. [QUOTE][b] The primary goal of Amtrka has to be transportation; the amenities of the trip can come second. [/b][/QUOTE] I agree to a point. On a trip of any length, certain amenities are essential. Food service, for example. [QUOTE][b] However, whenever I remark that Greyhound does a very good job at transporting people and should be an alternative to Amtrak - the common reply is that Greyhound stations are to dirty or the bus is crampt. [/b][/QUOTE] A bus, by its limited size, lacks the necessary facilities to meet passenger needs for longer than a few hours. It is therefore not suited to trips of much more than about 200-300 miles. The average long distance Amtrak train rider goes about 800 miles. [QUOTE][b] Well - thats just too tough- Greyhound does a fine job at transporting people in a timely manner... [/b][/QUOTE] Over short distances. For short trips, a bus is often the better alternative, due to greater flexibility in routing. For long trips, a bus just can't meet basic human needs such as for food, toilets, sleeping space, etc. [QUOTE][b] Now I'm sure that many people are going to label me as crazy, an idiot, an Amtrak hater or something of that manner. [/b][/QUOTE] I don't think you are an idiot. But I do not think that your beliefs are largely theoretical, and not based on real passengers who are every day riding the trains. [QUOTE][b] ...if trains are not going to serve as a efficient means of transportation, then I believe that a train has lost its purpose. [/b][/QUOTE] I see where you are coming from, but I still say they are convenient for many trips, and could be a lot more convenient if they were properly funded. If Amtrak can fill these trains even with all of their shortcomings, think how many trains they could fill if they did run on time! So the goal should not be to eliminate them, but to fully support them, so they can fulfill their potential! [QUOTE][b] Nor do I believe that trains should be in the entertainment/vacation business; [/b][/QUOTE] We've gone over this before. Please re-read my earlier posts. I see no need to repeat myself. [QUOTE][b] if Amtrak focused on small routes that could directly compete with air travel - it would thrive! [/b][/QUOTE] Actually, no. The corridor trains in California cover less than 50% of their costs at the farebox. The rest is subsidies. What would allow Amtrak to thrive would be a reliable source of capital, such as the aviation and highway trust funds, to enable it to effectively compete against airlines and highways. [/QB][/QUOTE]
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