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Im a budget, coach class traveler. Ive been searching prices for possible VIA travel in the future. I see many VIA prices are way too high for people like me. $400.00 to travel coach class on the canadian? Sleeper makes it near a thousand. Boy i sure hope its one of the great trains of the world at that price.
Kairho Member # 1567
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When you have a good product you can charge a lot more for it...
Gilbert B Norman Member # 1541
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What rate of exchange are you using between CD$ and US$?
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The bargains of bargains were the Canadian National Red White Blue/Rouge Blanc Bleu fares. Quite simply they were so low one couldn't afford NOT to take the train.
Canadian Pacific half heartedly matched their fares with something marketed as "Faresaver" so one could ride in dome cars up Kicking Horse Pass for the same absurd rates, although CP carefully limited the number of accomodations they would sell at those rates.
While the CP Budd equipment (VIA's today) was clearly superior to the 'colorful' collection of light and heavyweight equipment as well as hand me downs from US roads (domes? they had a few ex-MILW, but they were scarce and were added only for the passage through the Rockies), CP really made one on the reduced fareplan feel like a second class citizen. You would be fed at either 5PM or 9PM and be served whatever the 'crew hash of the day was to be'. You could not access the regular menu, even for a surcharge. During my 'bumper to bumper' 1965 ride on the Canadian, I got sick and tired of that fast and simply "chucked' the meal coupons to enjoy CP's Prime Rib and their Lamb Chops at 7PM if I chose.
But as Mr Kairho noted, why give something away for which you can get a good price?
royaltrain Member # 622
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If, Mr. Norman, you were travelling in CP's standard sleeping cars you would have received the same food and service as every other standard sleeping car passenger regardless of the fare paid. Possibly you were travelling in the tourist sleeper which I believe may still have been around in the mid sixties. On my first ride on CP's Canadian in 1970 in a sleeper, and paying the low fare in effect at that time, I received a superb Canadian Pacific meal. Every passenger was given the same menu and we could have anything we wanted on that menu. By the 1970's the tourist sleepers were gone and therefore all sleeping car passengers rode in the Budd-built sleeping cars and ate in the regular dining car with their meals included in the fare. Later in the 70's CP allowed passengers to purchase either the inclusive plan (no meals) or the all inclusive plan (with meals). The all inclusive plan was a very good deal, and it may have lasted until Via took it over but I'm not sure. I know after Via started operating both the CN and CP trains they did not offer a plan that included meals. It was not until about a year or two after the introduction of Silver and Blue on The Canadian that the "all inclusive" plan that included sleeper with meals made a come back (of course the fares are very much higher as the market now rules).
Gilbert B Norman Member # 1541
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I assure you, Mr. Royal, I was most definitely not in a tourist sleeper for my 1965 Canadian ride, although I will admit I walked to the head of the train to view them.
I further restate under the CP "Faresaver Plan' only certain dishes were available. The Prime Rib, Lamb chops, and Steak were off limits and not available even for a surcharge. As I noted earlier, I simply scrapped the meal coupons and ate what I wanted.
That Pime Rib was excellent; I can remember having it aboard the Princess Margaret last during 1974.
royaltrain Member # 622
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I am surprised that CP had a policy in 1965 of having different standards for sleeping car passengers. By 1970 when I started riding CP trains, all sleeping car passengers were paying the same all-inclusive fare and received the same menu. When you identified yourself as a sleeping car passenger, the dining car steward removed a coupon from your ticket and attached it to your bill. The passenger received breakfast, lunch and dinner coupons which were valid for whatever was on the menu. Dining car reservations were issued to each sleeping car passenger and the passenger could choose whatever sitting was available.
Gilbert B Norman Member # 1541
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Pleased to learn, Mr. Royal, CP modified that policy. Your description of the coupon lift was same as for my ride.
I certainly must note that considering how anti-passenger the CP was regarding proclaimed policy, they sure had a 'class act' forty years ago. While many disagree, I consider the SP to be of the same ilk down here below the 49th.
Ironic how the other guys who were "pro-passenger' were running their service with a bunch of cobbled together hand me down equipment, yet with a lot of "puff, paint, and pizzaz'.
David Member # 3
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quote:Originally posted by Gilbert B Norman: I assure you, Mr. Royal, I was most definitely not in a tourist sleeper for my 1965 Canadian ride, although I will admit I walked to the head of the train to view them.
I further restate under the CP "Faresaver Plan' only certain dishes were available. The Prime Rib, Lamb chops, and Steak were off limits and not available even for a surcharge. As I noted earlier, I simply scrapped the meal coupons and ate what I wanted.
That Pime Rib was excellent; I can remember having it aboard the Princess Margaret last during 1974.
I didn't start riding The Canadian until 1968, but at that time passengers on the All- inclusive Plan could order anything from the menu except for the sirloin steak and dine at any sitting. In fact, it was rare for passengers to purchase sleeper tickets without meals (called the Inclusive Plan) because the difference was so little. Thrifty travellers could eat in the Skyline coffee shop, I suppose. What Mr. Norman says about restricted menus seems very unfair of the CPR because they didn't mention that in their adverts. I have pulled out the 1965 timetable which explains the virtues of the All-inclusive Plan in a full page notice. Only the All-inclusive fares are quoted on the Sample Fare page; there was just a vague mention that passengers "occupying any type of room accommodation" could purchase tickets without meals.
By the way, the one-way fare from Toronto to Vancouver in a roomette in 1965, All-inclusive Plan, was $87. Forty years later, VIA was charging over $1800 (plus 7% federal tax - not VIA's fault) for the same roomette. Even taking into account inflation, that is quite a jump.
Mr. Norman, you mention the Prime Rib on the Princess Margaret. Do you mean by chance the CPR's Princess Marguerite which was on the Seattle - Victoria run? That was indeed a splendid vessel. Those coastal vessels were run by the railway. The trans-Atlantic and cruise ships were run by Canadian Pacific Steamships, later called CP Ships.
Gilbert B Norman Member # 1541
posted Mr. Norman, you mention the Prime Rib on the Princess Margaret. Do you mean by chance the CPR's Princess Marguerite which was on the Seattle - Victoria run? That was indeed a splendid vessel. Those coastal vessels were run by the railway. The trans-Atlantic and cruise ships were run by Canadian Pacific Steamships, later called CP Ships
That indeed, Mr. David, is the vessel to which I refer. During 1974, they still offered full restaurant service in a separate "salon' adorned with the 'as built' wood paneled interior. Even at that date, most of the food service appeared to be a cafeteria (uh, 'Buffet' in currentspeak). I understand that within a year after my sailing, the restaurant was history.
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