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Having lived in St Louis from 1955 - 1981, I am pleased to find a way to sneak my delight at the Cardinal's victory into the forum. I see little activity, so to stir the pot a bit (this from one who remains silent for months at a time): When did major league teams stop traveling by train and begin traveling more by plane. I dare say it must have been the 50s.
I suspect that air travel made a difference in the scheduling as well. Were there team railroad cars? Owners cars?
Do we have a railroad historian amongst (sp) us?
Is there a book about baseball and train travel?
Is there balm in Gilead? Oops. I mean is there balm in Arlington...
Ira
Ocala Mike Member # 4657
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Remember the "Boys of Summer"? Well, sometime in 1954 this (then 12-year old) Dodger fan found himself at Grand Central Terminal one summer afternoon to see, quite by accident, the Brooklyn Dodgers board the 4:00 Ohio Limited to Cincinnati. They were not very happy hitting the road, having just lost a series to their archrivals, the Giants, the team that would subsequently win the pennant and World Series that year.
Of course, I didn't know that the Brooklyn Dodgers and rail travel for MLB would soon be rendered extinct with their move, along with the hated Giants, to the West Coast in just a few years necessitating jet age travel.
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As Mike immediately notes, once the two Major Leagues expanded beyond the four corners the Northeast and North Central regions, it was "TILT; game over' for rail travel. So let's see, Horace Stoneham took up reading Horace Greeley during 1956 and "airfan" Walter O'Malley became the real "Bum" during 1958.
Obviously other than trips within the Corridor, where rail travel remains an option that is used by MLB, NFL, NHL and NBA, "one a day' makes rail travel unreasonable and impractical. Like it or not, you don't pay some prima donna $20M a season (whether he can hit or not) to play a sport in which the term salary cap has yet to enter the lexicon to sit around and ride trains. Even the "Eagle Series", i.e. 2011 Cardinals v. Rangers, would have been simply out of the question (just to start: where would have Amtrak come up with four Superliner Sleepers - a 370XX "CCC" Diner Lounge no big deal - to move the road show?) .
Actually, the Brooklyn Dodgers "went way back" with aviation; here is material regarding the Dodger's CV-240 acquired during 1957:
So let's see, Horace Stoneham took up reading Horace Greeley during 1956 and "airfan" Walter O'Malley became the real "Bum" during 1958.
Actually, both teams moved simultaneously at the close of the 1957 season, and both teams began the 1958 season in the Golden State. One of the biggest conspiracies in baseball since the Black Sox.
Mr. Slotkin raised an interesting point about private rail cars for teams and owners, though. I don't believe any of those existed, but I do wonder myself how New York Central handled moving an entire team on sleepers on an overnight regularly-scheduled train. Extra cars added in advance?
Gilbert B Norman Member # 1541
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Somewhere I read that Umpires always traveled in separate cars if not separate trains.
palmland Member # 4344
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My two favorite hobbies - baseball and trains. Congratulations to the Cardinals, Ira. As an Atlanta Braves fan I was rooting for them throughout the playoffs. My convoluted logic: The Braves were one strike away from the playoffs, ergo, they were within one strike of being World Champs.
Thanks for the interesting link, Mike. I'd love to sit down with Don Zimmer and hear his tales. I would imagine the Pullman company pulled out a couple Pullmans from their huge pool and added them to an existing train or maybe a second section. But, did they also add a diner and lounge? Can't imagine 25 ballplayers, press etc. invading a sedate lounge car on the Commodore Vanderbilt. And, can you imagine Derek Jeter, or any of today's millionaire ballplayers, in an upper berth or even a roomette.
yukon11 Member # 2997
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An interesting book which might appeal to both early baseball and railroad fans is one called, "If I Never Get Back", by Darryl Brock.
It is sort of a time-travel trip back to look at the Cincinnati Red Stocking baseball club (precursor to the Cincinnati Reds), which was the nation's first professional baseball team. Back then, there wasn't any formal baseball league, and the Cincinnati ball club traveled, by train, to play various teams across the country. The book includes authentic railroads and authentic Cincinnati Red Stocking players.
Richard
Vincent206 Member # 15447
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Prior to the move of the Dodgers and Giants to California, baseball on the west coast was dominated by the Pacific Coast League. In the 1950s the PCL consisted of the LA Angels, Oakland Oaks, Portland Beavers, Sacramento Solons, San Diego Padres, San Francisco Seals, Seattle Rainiers and the Hollywood Stars. I can imagine that the SP carried a lot of baseball related traffic.
yukon11 Member # 2997
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quote:Originally posted by Vincent206: Prior to the move of the Dodgers and Giants to California, baseball on the west coast was dominated by the Pacific Coast League. In the 1950s the PCL consisted of the LA Angels, Oakland Oaks, Portland Beavers, Sacramento Solons, San Diego Padres, San Francisco Seals, Seattle Rainiers and the Hollywood Stars. I can imagine that the SP carried a lot of baseball related traffic.
******************************************* Growing up in Northern Calif. in the 50's, Vincent, I attended several San Francisco Seals baseball games in the old Seals Stadium. I remember that you would practically freeze to death, by the late innings, without a heavy jacket. I once saw a documentary that stated the old Pacific Coast League was so popular, that some of the PCL baseball players' salaries, on average, exceeded many of those of major league baseball players.
Richard
palmland Member # 4344
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That book looks interesting, yukon. Several years ago we were in San Jose waiting for the Starlight. The station was crawling with Giants fans heading for the afternoon game on a baseball special. Nice to see. They used to be a regular occurrence for the Phillies games in the 50's.
Railroad Bob Member # 3508
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Here out West, the Surfliners still get regular heavy ridership during game times at Anaheim's Angel stadium, especially during their World Series run a while back. Convenient for the fans; the park is an easy walk across from the train station also served by Metrolink. The "fan draw" comes from both rail directions and fans represent home and away teams.
Side note: (but football related) Amtrak did carry John Madden around quite a bit during his coaching and commentator days. He used regularly scheduled Amtrak long hauls, such as the Sunset. Famous for his aversion to flying, Greyhound pulled him off the trains with an offer of a personal coach and driver...I think he returned the favor with regular "pep talks" to the Greyhound organization.
Popular passenger was Madden; I recall seeing him "holding court" in an immensely smoky Heritage lounge car trundling east on an 80's era Sunset Ltd. Madden was spinning stories to a rapt and manly audience, fueled by adult beverages winding off into the wee hours...
yukon11 Member # 2997
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Speaking of the Anaheim Angels and their Pacific Coast League counterpart, the Los Angeles Angels, I wonder how many will remember this Pacific Coast League LA Angels player, from the early 1950's:
The player is Chuck Connors, who played Lucas McCain in the TV western, "The Rifleman". Connors also played, briefly, for the Brooklyn Dodgers, Chicago Cubs, and Boston Celtics. He was also in Airplane II, playing "The Sarge".
Richard
cubzo Member # 4700
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I ride the Surfliner about twice a year to go to games at Petco Park. And the Coast Starlight once every other year to attend AT&T Park.
Every spring I scan the Cubs schedule to see if they're playing at the local ball yards.
We were planning on a Surfliner trip to San Diego this Sunday to watch my Packers play but looks like they have track work. They will be busing folks.
Ocala Mike Member # 4657
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quote:Originally posted by yukon11:
The player is Chuck Connors, who played Lucas McCain in the TV western, "The Rifleman". Connors also played, briefly, for the Brooklyn Dodgers, Chicago Cubs, and Boston Celtics. He was also in Airplane II, playing "The Sarge".
Major thread creep alert. His real name was Kevin Connors, and he is another Brooklyn boy who made good. That's not all he made, however, as he supposedly appeared in an early gay porn movie.
cubzo Member # 4700
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Mr Connors was also the first person to break a backboard in a pro basketball game. I believe he was playing for the Celtics at the time.
Ira Slotkin Member # 81
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Thanks for the info and the links!!!
Tanner929 Member # 3720
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The Philadelphia Phillies used Amtrak during the 2009 World Series for their trip's to and from New York
Ocala Mike Member # 4657
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Yes, and in a somewhat dated reference, Atlanta Braves pitcher John Rocker never took the #7 train to Shea Stadium. Wonder where he is now.
palmland Member # 4344
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Baseball made Amtrak news again as the Yankees took the train to Boston as reported here.
It's interesting that they boarded at the Yankees stop on the Hudson line. How would that have made it over to the ex New Haven RR to Beantown?
Gilbert B Norman Member # 1541
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At Mott Haven, MO Tower, trains can, in addition to heading to GCT, can head East along the Harlem Division to Woodlawn - just as New Haven Railroad trains do. 153rd St is a regular Hudson Division stop.
There was no need to tie up a scarce P32ACDM for this move. Metro North P32ACDM 's are in Diesel mode by the time they arrive at 125th St.
PullmanCo Member # 1138
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The Dodgers had both a Lockheed Electra and a Boeing 720 after their move to LA.
The Boeing eventually retired in the Air Force boneyard at Davis-Monthan AFB, because it was of the same airframe as the C/KC/VC-135.
Gilbert B Norman Member # 1541
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Actually, teams were ditching trains even when baseball's "outer limits" were the Mississippi and Ohio Rivers.
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