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Quick Questions: Is there an elevator that leads from the Acella waiting room at NY Penn Station down to its platform?
I took the train from NYP to DC last year and Prince, the redcap, helped me and my sister get on board the train. I think he may have avoided the escalator by taking us down an elevator, but quite frankly I have forgotten.
Also, my research indicates that it is 60 feet from the concourse to the platform. That's quite a distance. Do you suppose that is true?
And finally, if we took a cab from Brooklyn to Penn Station, where do you suppose we would have been let out: 34th street?
Any help on these matters would be greatly appreciated.
-------------------- Please visit "Chucksville" at http://www.chucksville.com and sign my guestbook! Posts: 324 | From: Albuquerque, New Mexico, USA | Registered: Jan 2003
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There are elevators from the lower concourse to the platforms but I'm not sure if they are in place for all platforms. If you're arriving by cab from Brooklyn, it's best to go up 8th Ave. and get out at 31st St. There's an escalator to the Amtrak concourse right there.
Posts: 49 | From: Brookline, MA | Registered: Sep 2007
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Your comment makes sense. I remember going down an escallator to a subway in Washington DC that dwarfed the distance between the concourse and the platform. I also remember a similar descent to the redline subway in Los Angeles.
Perhaps 60 feet was considered a great distance around 1900.
Also, unless Amtrak has found a way to get around the Americans With Disabilities Act, I would guess that there would have to be an elevator to the Acella platform. (I mean, I have noticed that even the Chicago El has elevators to most of the platforms in the Loop, but you have to look hard for some of them.)
Metsox,
Thanks for the info. When you say there is an escalator to the concourse, I get a little confused. I assume the concourse is the place where the Acella "waiting room" is, as well as that big Arrivals/Departure Sign. But wasn't that at ground level? Isn't the concourse synonomous with what we commonly refer to as the Great Hall in places like Chicago and DC Union station?
Doesn't make much sence to me that one would have to take an escalator to the main floor of a train station.
Thanks....
-------------------- Please visit "Chucksville" at http://www.chucksville.com and sign my guestbook! Posts: 324 | From: Albuquerque, New Mexico, USA | Registered: Jan 2003
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There is an elevator between every Amtrak track/platform and the LOWER concourse, but only one of these elevators goes all the way to or from the UPPER Concourse (where the ticket booths & waiting areas are, still 1 level below street level). On the Upper Concourse this elevator is located right near where the police have a desk facing the Big Arrivals/Departure Board, not far & kind of in between the Club ACELA Lounge (the one accessed by ringing a bell) and the Main Waiting Area (now also labeled "Acela Express"--btw Acela is spelled with one l, not two). So you can always take elevators to track level, but you usually have to change from one to another (unless you are lucky enough to have your train leaving from the track with the 2-level elevator).
There are also elevators to get from the Upper Concourse to street level, although to my knowledge they are not as close to the Amtrak ticket/waiting area part of Penn Station.
If you did not specify where you wanted to be let off, I doubt you were let off at 34th St. Penn Station is really between West 31st & West 33rd St, running 7th Ave to 8th Ave. There is access to the underground maze on 34th St, but it's not where a cab would ordinarily go, unless you asked him (and it's a long underground walk then to Penn Station proper). If you just asked to go to Amtrak and did not specify a location, you may have been let off on E 31st halfway down between 7th Av & 8th Av. This is a middle area into which you used to be able to drive, but since 9-11 you now have to get off on E 31st and walk in)--the is an overhead covering as you walk along so that you don't get wet--and there is an elevator here so you don't need to use any escalators, but I prefer the escalator, since the elevator often smells like pee!--the elevator here leaves you out near the Krispy Kreme on the Upper Concourse.e corner of E 31st or E 33rd, where there now an escalator down to the Amtrak area of the Upper Concourse.
Or you could have been let off on 8th Av at the corner of E 31st or E 33rd. There is only an esclator here, far as a I know, but it does bring you down closest to Amtrak. There would not be any Red Caps here, though.
Or you could have been let off at the main entrance on 7th Avenue, but that is closer to the Long Island Railroad than Amtrak (so you walk more once you go in) and there is no elevator here--also no REd Caps, though there is a fellow who organizes the taxi line. (There now IS an elevator at the new entrance labeled NJ Transit at the corner of E 31st & 7th Av; but this entrance is new--wasn't here last year; also no Red Caps here either).
Posts: 2642 | From: upstate New York | Registered: Mar 2004
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From our 2008 trip, all I remember is that from train level, we had to take, I believe, 2 escalators up to the ticket level (where Club Acela is), but to get back to the boarding platform, I thought there was one longer escalator from near the Club Acela, which went down to trainside.
Posts: 2428 | From: Grayling, MI | Registered: Mar 2002
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RRich, usually there is one escalator from the platform that goes just to the Lower Concourse (where you have to roam around a bit to find the other escalabor) but there is another all the way to Upper Concourse. If you ask a conductor/car attendant, they can direct you to the best one.
Posts: 2642 | From: upstate New York | Registered: Mar 2004
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quote:Originally posted by Charles Reuben: Also, my research indicates that it is 60 feet from the concourse to the platform. That's quite a distance. Do you suppose that is true?
The tracks for all roads (AMTK, NJT, LIRR) are three levels below street; at 20 feet per level, this is likely the source of the 60 feet reference.
As noted, from track level, there are escalators to both the First (LIRR) and Second (AMTK, NJT) levels (7th Ave is the Third in this example.
As others have noted, and in this ADA conscious world, it stands to reason that there is elevator access between all levels. If, as I fear is the case, that you or your Sister have any kind of disability issues, those elevators are there for your use whether you have engaged a Red Cap or not.
As I recall, the Penn Station taxi stand is on "Seventh and a Quarter Ave' or between the buildings on 7th Ave and The Garden. But so long as 'Mr. Shanks and Miss Mare' remain healthy, I haven't much occasion to know what a taxicab is within Midtown Manhattan (the livery car that was my "Escape from Brooklyn" last October was an exception).
Posts: 9975 | From: Clarendon Hills, IL USA (BNSF Chicago Sub MP 18.71) | Registered: Apr 2002
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The 8th Avenue entrance is best for Amtrak. One goes down the escalator and turns left to go to Club Acela (just one "l" in that name), right to go to baggage check. Note that Penn Station is between West 31 and 33 Streets, and not East, as was earlier stated.
Posts: 255 | Registered: Nov 2001
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I'm going to have to read all your posts several times before all this sinks in. But it's important for me to understand what it is that I did when I rode the Acela, because I want to write about it in my blog.
Sorry about mispelling Acela. That is surely the gods revenge for me having criticized my former congressional representative for her spelling of "Amtrack."
So, you're probably all wondering why I even asked all these questions. Here's why, in a nutshell.
Although I never saw the old Penn Station that was demolished in 1963, I have always been repelled by the new Penn Station. Everytime I look at a photograph of the old Penn Station, I have to wonder, "what were they thinking?" when they decided to tear it down.
So, I guess the next question for you oldtimers is, "was it any easier to get around the old Penn Station?" It sure wasn't very easy to get in and around the new one, as I recall.
And don't worry, Mr. Norman, neither me or my sister are handicapped. We just had a lot of luggage and we were a bit overwhelmed by everything. We found Mr. Prince at the "Club Acela Lounge" and he seemed quite willing to help us out. Mr. Prince was a charming fellow. I wish I had asked him whether he ever met Joe Biden.
The reason I asked about the elevator was because those Redcaps really can be helpful when it's a mob scene. I recall a very stressful moment in the Toronto train station when I was trying to catch an Amtrak train to Detroit (this was right after 9/11) and I'm sure there was an Amtrak train that went that way, though we had to get off at the border and cross a body of water by bus, which was a real pain. The reason we took the damn bus was because they were afraid somebody might bomb the tunnel that was normally used by the train.
Anyway, I hired a very sweet, gay redcap in Toronto to get me on the train and he managed to take me down an elevator and through many secret back passages to the train, effectively cutting ahead of at least a half mile of angry and impatient passengers.
Best $10 I ever spent.
-------------------- Please visit "Chucksville" at http://www.chucksville.com and sign my guestbook! Posts: 324 | From: Albuquerque, New Mexico, USA | Registered: Jan 2003
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Charles -- there hasn't been an AMTRAK train from Toronto to Detroit for many many MANY years -- back in the 70's, there was a short-lived "Niagara Rainbow" train which ran from DET-TWO, but it only lasted a few years (I believe it was partially funded by the Michigan DOT, and I was living and working in MI at that time).
On your trip, you likely took a VIA corridor train from Toronto to Windsor, then took a connecting bus across the St. Clair River into Detroit.
Posts: 2428 | From: Grayling, MI | Registered: Mar 2002
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To continue, "Old Penn" was simply ahead of the preservation curve in New York that really did not take hold until the '80's, Be assured that Grand Central was on the list for a wrecking ball. I think a "twin tower" was planned to match Pan Am/Met Life. Rail passengers? who cares about them; they're only in the station maybe five minutes before their (commuter) trains leaves.
But from one who is of "been there done that' standing, you really did not want to see "Old Penn" in its twilight. The walls were only cleaned to headroom height (and not very clean at that), the skylights were understandably blacked out during WWII, but was the paint ever removed?
And the eyesore of eyesores was the flying saucer ticket office that "landed' in the concourse replacing the ticket cages they became concession space. The place had become such a dump, and even despite some very poignant New York Times editorials urging its preservation, I'm certain that near term, many were glad to see it go.
While I realize that today the architectural value of the present day facility is simply zero, it does move a lot of people, albeit mostly commuters, expediently and efficiently.
Posts: 9975 | From: Clarendon Hills, IL USA (BNSF Chicago Sub MP 18.71) | Registered: Apr 2002
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According to Wikpedia, the train I took way back when was the International Limited, which ceased service in 2004. It was an Amtrak train that went from Toronto to Chicago via Sarnia, where I detrained to take a bus across, I assume, the St. Clair River. There was definitely a tunnel there, but because of terrorist threat, it was being bypassed by that bus I spoke about. The train went through the tunnel without passengers and then reloaded at the other side.
A simple 20 minute train ride turned into an exhausting and expensive (for some taxpayer) four hour ordeal.
-------------------- Please visit "Chucksville" at http://www.chucksville.com and sign my guestbook! Posts: 324 | From: Albuquerque, New Mexico, USA | Registered: Jan 2003
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Allow me to concur there is a rail tunnel at Sarnia and which was recently expanded to handle cars such as tri-level auto racks and double-stack containers.
The rail tunnel at Detroit can only handle standard height cars (OK technocrats; get out the AAR "plates' for more specifics) and belongs to CSX and friends (namely CP). CN, and US subsidiary Grand Trunk, handles their Detroit international traffic by means of car ferries.
Posts: 9975 | From: Clarendon Hills, IL USA (BNSF Chicago Sub MP 18.71) | Registered: Apr 2002
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Mr. Norman: The Sarnia tunnel was not just expanded, it was replaced with a parallel tunnel large enough to handle double stacks. It was said that it took over 400 permits from various agencies on both sides of the border before construction could start. I have better info in a Railway Age or Railway Track and Structures of the time frame in which it happened.
Posts: 2808 | From: Olive Branch MS | Registered: Nov 2002
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GBN -- I stand corrected about the Niagara Rainbow -- yes, it was in fact routed DET-BUF-NYC via Niagara Falls.
Charles -- yes the International did run from Toronto to Chicago via Sarnia; however, it did not serve Detroit. It served Port Huron, MI, which is on the other side of the tunnel from Sarnia. The waterway between Sarnia and Port Huron is also the St. Clair River, which flows between Lake Huron, Lake St. Clair, and Lake Erie.
Posts: 2428 | From: Grayling, MI | Registered: Mar 2002
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On our first/only visit to NYP this past August we found the elevator from/to the platform we arrived/departed from NOT working. Caveat Emptor. Best regards, Rodger
Posts: 112 | From: Merrimac, MA | Registered: Nov 2007
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