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Author Topic: It's All Over - Joe
Gilbert B Norman
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Mr. Helfner, you and I are "on the same page" to the extent that Joe's acceptance of Bernie, Liz, and The Squad's definition of "infrastructure" is "too far".

I was all in favor of helping those adversely affected by COVID, such as performing artists and hospitality workers, but with all the employers willing to pay "$15hr for a warm body that shows up", the need for the "social infrastructure" greatly diminishes.

I continue to be in favor of the enacted legislation, IIJA21, directing $100B in each of the next ten years to renew "hard" infrastructure. Both political parties have neglected such for too long, and now, such must be addressed before something catastrophic occurrs.

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Gilbert B Norman
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It cannot be overlooked that Joe right now (not the end of his term) is the oldest person ever to be POTUS:

Journal Editorial

Fair Use:
  • The party nominated Mr. Biden as a caretaker President with the sole job of beating Mr. Trump. As a concession to identity politics, Mr. Biden pledged to pick a woman Vice President, and then he settled on Ms. Harris
Of course, provide short term relief to aid those adversely affected by COVID; of course fix the infrastructure, as "we the people" had ignored it too long.

But, Joe, you were not given a mandate to transform our society such as was LBJ, and to a lesser extent, Obama. You were given, as the Journal's Editorial Board notes, a mandate to get rid of Trump and otherwise have a "caretaker, bring us together", presidency.

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irishchieftain
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Biden never made pretensions to be a “caretaker” anywhere in his campaign; he was very open about continuing the anti-Constitutional “transformational” depredations of Obama and LBJ (and many others in between from both “parties”). Where do these false retrospects come from?
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Gilbert B Norman
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Mr. Helfner, I DID hear references that Joe intended to govern as a "Centrist" which meant to me, on the Dem side, Carter or Clinton, and on the Rep, both Bushes.

I only heard "Build Back Better" to regard infrastructure, and that was on Joe's Cleveland to Pittsburgh "whistle stop" train ride.

Never did I hear reference to the "Build Back Better Act of 2021" (that's its title) in the campaign beyond its use as a slogan. But must say, BBBA21 sounds "catchy".

Finally, let it be noted that it was the Journal's Editorial Board who used the term "caretaker", even though I "buy into" such.

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irishchieftain
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The phrase “build back better” ranks among Biden’s infamous list of plagiarized statements, this one from the United Nations in the context of disaster relief, and plagiarized before him by Bill Clinton and Boris Johnson. The execution follows the pattern of Obama’s “stimulus” spending and what they tried to squeeze into it is not unexpected, really.

As for what “centrist” means if anything (also not a word used by Biden IIRC), that seems to have shifted ever leftwards over the years, if there could be a “center” position between governing according to the US Constitution and governing according to socialist principles. Notwithstanding, depredations against the family, private property, religious freedom and the integrity of the border of the Union are purely out of the Communist Manifesto.

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Gilbert B Norman
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Mr. Helfner, look what I stumbled into when searching for the date in January for the SOTU.
As I noted way earlier in this topic, that could be Joe's last day as President.

https://dailyangle.com/articles/will-biden-make-it-till-january-s-state-of-the-union

The date for the '22 SOTU has not yet been set. There is no constitutional requirement for such, and it was not until Wilson that it was delivered in person before a Joint Session.

US Constitution;
  • He shall from time to time give to the Congress Information of the State of the Union, and recommend to their Consideration such Measures as he shall judge necessary and expedient

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Gilbert B Norman
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quote:
Originally posted by George Harris:
As someone who was amazed that Biden won in the first place, and who considered him obviously totally unqualified for the job from the get-go....

Mr. Harris, were it not for COVID, which some could argue has been among the most devastating political, social, or economic event, to occur in the history of our Republic, I believe Trump would have been re-elected.

I also believe that had Hillary won in '16, she too would have been defeated in '20.

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irishchieftain
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Neither the disease nor the government’s response to it (which amounts to a massive attempted power grab) had any effect on the election. However, the statistical impossibility of Biden’s alleged 81 million votes, and the dangers of mail-in voting that are still extant, is still the open question that those in power continue to wish everyone would ignore.
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George Harris
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quote:
Originally posted by irishchieftain:
Neither the disease nor the government’s response to it (which amounts to a massive attempted power grab) had any effect on the election. However, the statistical impossibility of Biden’s alleged 81 million votes, and the dangers of mail-in voting that are still extant, is still the open question that those in power continue to wish everyone would ignore.

With you 100% on this one. Like the joke, "my father voted Republican every presidential race since Kennedy until Biden, but when he voted for Biden he had been in the ground for 10 years."
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Gilbert B Norman
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Here is a tremendous Times column that sums up why I voted for Joe - and why I have become disappointed.

Why I voted for Joe:
  • Gail: I’m happy. Never bought into the idea that President Biden was elected just to not be Donald Trump.
Why I am disappointed:
  • Bret: Despite what you said earlier, I don’t think Biden was elected to be a transformative president the way Reagan or Obama were, both of whom had clear electoral mandates to change America. He was elected to be a steadying presence. Biden’s failed totally so far, partly for reasons that were not under his control, like the persistence of the pandemic, and partly for reasons that were, like the bungled exit from Afghanistan.

    Either way, he is misreading his mandate, and the new legislation won’t help. It’s deeply unwise to try to change the entire shape of government based on a tiebreaking vote in the Senate. It’s even more unwise to do so when prices for groceries and gas seem to be rising by the minute... Biden is overseeing a combustible mixture of sweeping progressive social change and working-class economic distress — a formula that gave us Trump in 2016 and may give us Trump again in 2024. And all this is on top of the already hyperpolarized culture we have in this country.
Now I respect, Messrs. Harris and Helfner, you have your reasons to have supported Donald Trump, and why you both would welcome his return to the White House as either the 47th, or as I think the case, the 48th POTUS.

Happy Thanx; I'll be celebrating with friends where I'd best keep my thoughts about Joe's disappointment to myself, for his agenda is quite revered where I will be (he: an Educator; she: a Social Worker).

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George Harris
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quote:
Originally posted by Gilbert B Norman:
Happy Thanx; I'll be celebrating with friends where I'd best keep my thoughts about Joe's disappointment to myself, for his agenda is quite revered where I will be (he: an Educator; she: a Social Worker).

The continued support this man has from presumably intelligent and educated people is a major mystery to me. In every aspect he has proven worse than I anticipated, and I anticipated that his performance would not be good, to say the least.
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Gilbert B Norman
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Mr. Harris, Bachelor's, Master's, ACSW, LCSW between my hosts.

I'm just a Bachelor's and a CPA.

But pedigrees aside, this Journal columnist holds that Joe could possibly recover and even serve out his term:

Fair Use:
  • Which brings us back to Mr. Biden. His presidency has been dragged down by unforced errors such as the chaotic withdrawal from Afghanistan, unanticipated events such as the outbreak of the Delta variant, misjudgments such as minimizing the threat of inflation for too long, and the public perception that he is less competent and more liberal than he appeared during the campaign. Whatever happens over the next 11 months, it seems inevitable that Republicans will control the House after the midterm elections. A new poll conducted by Donald Trump’s super PAC found the former president leading Mr. Biden in five swing states.
Possibly my earlier speculation that Joe could be gone in about two more months (after the SOTU) is a bit premature, but shortly after the 118th Congress convenes cannot be ruled out.

I just wish both parties had found different candidates to run in '20 - and PLEASE do so for '24, lest I live out my final years along the shores of the Wolfgangsee.

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irishchieftain
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Bret Stephens is getting more desperate to make things up, I see. So this is the narrative, and the truth about the openly “transformative” presidential campaign gets cast down the memory hole. (And that’s aside from the Times’ continuing antisemitic stance, never mind the Journal’s pro-communistic anti-borders stance.)
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irishchieftain
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quote:
quote:
Originally posted by Gilbert B Norman:
Happy Thanx; I’ll be celebrating with friends where I'd best keep my thoughts about Joe's disappointment to myself, for his agenda is quite revered where I will be (he: an Educator; she: a Social Worker).

Originally posted by George Harris:
The continued support this man has from presumably intelligent and educated people is a major mystery to me. In every aspect he has proven worse than I anticipated, and I anticipated that his performance would not be good, to say the least.

I for my part expected exactly what we got, albeit at a slower pace; but the fact that the pace has been sped up shows the desperation of the left to accelerate their long-delayed “revolution” that is based in national socialism rather than “worker solidarity” or suchlike.

So perhaps as a Thanksgiving theme, the desire to put paid to this revolution once and for all should be paramount, and to recognize the personalities for what they are and what they actually did/do.

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George Harris
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quote:
Originally posted by Gilbert B Norman:
Mr. Harris, Bachelor's, Master's, ACSW, LCSW between my hosts.

I'm just a Bachelor's and a CPA.

Actually, given their fields of expertise I am not surprised at their viewpoints as I have seen plenty of others I thought should have known better, regardless of my lack of understanding how awareness of the events of the last year enable people to hold them. But then on the other hand it seems for much of the press Biden can do no wrong.

But then I am BSCE and PE, so maybe a lifetime of dealing with building and out of a family that has always been oriented to things either construction, medical, or other things considered to be part of the "hard" sciences makes believing and dealing with these feel good ideas, many of which seem to ignore any form of economic reality seem silly.

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Gilbert B Norman
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The Afghanistan debacle is no longer front page, and Joe's job approval has stabilized - albeit at a dangerously low level. Accordingly, I must back away from my prediction "he's gone" after the SOTU (whenever it may be; addendum March 1).

But Bret Stevens, in his Times column appearing in print today, makes points, even if hard to take for staunch Democrats, that simply cannot be dismissed:

Fair Use:
  • In 2019, the Biden campaign — cognizant of the candidate’s age — sold him to primary voters as a “transition figure,” the guy whose main purpose was to dethrone Trump and then smooth the way for a fresher Democratic face. Biden never made that promise explicit, but the expectation feels betrayed.

    Things might be different if the Biden presidency were off to a great start. It’s not. Blame Joe Manchin or Mitch McConnell or the antivaxxers, but Biden’s poll numbers have been deeply underwater since August. The man who once gave his party hope now weighs on his party’s fortunes like a pair of cement shoes.
I voted for Joe simply to do my part to be rid of Trump (well, at least for four years), but then to be conciliatory "bring us together" president.

Help those who have legitimately been adversely affected by COVID? of course. Address infrastructure? well no choice (that bridge just up a bit up on Ol' Man River from you, Mr. Harris, sure had to be a wake up call) as too many politicians had ignored it.

But this transformative proposed social legislation? That is not what a caretaker president, especially one with razor thin majorities in both Houses, was given a mandate to do.

My "Joe's resignation target" has now been set back to Spring '23. The 118th Congress will find both houses under Republican control; and all Joe will have is the veto. It will be "anarchy on the Potomac".

Possibly President Harris will somehow "hold things together" until '24, when in all likelihood, there will be a Republican elected - and hopefully "duly elected".

full disclosure: author's all time presidential voting record: 7R, 7D, 1I

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Gilbert B Norman
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Another quote from the immediately cited Bret Stephens column:
  • And it needn’t diminish his presidency. George H.W. Bush accomplished more in four years than his successor accomplished in eight. Greatness is often easier to achieve when good policies aren’t encumbered by clever politics. Biden should think on it — and act soon.
While I'm inclined to disagree that Bill Clinton did little, GHWB certainly did a lot.

He, in collaboration SECSTATE James Baker and Gen. Powell, put in place a master plan to ensure stability, and maybe peace, in Iraq. The concept of we keep enough forces in the region to keep a lid on Saddam,but give him enough forces to keep a lid on his "bad guys", I think was a "stroke of genius".

Why his son had to disrupt that master plan simply escapes me resulting in a totally needless war.

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George Harris
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While I considered President Joe a disaster, which it has become, the thought of a President Kamala would have me wake up screaming in terror. If we were to see a Trump/DeSantis combo, I would all but crawl over broken glass to vote for them, and try to get my parents to do likewise, unlike last time when they, along with the majority of other Elmwood Cemetery residents, voted Biden. Trump likewise actually got a lot accomplished, most of it lost to the public in the screaming of the press. I voted Trump in 2016 as the lesser of two evils, but in 2020 with a good deal of enthusiasm.
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George Harris
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Oh yeah, the Memphis bridge: Based on some of the discussion in Engineering publications the failure appears to be result of some failures in initial fabrication that left a point of stress concentration. The crack in question had been growing for several years and missed in inspections until complete failure occurred. Despite arm waving in the press, it was not in danger of collapse due to structural redundancy, but it was weakened to the point that closing it to truck traffic, particularly westbound, would have been a good call. Closing it to all traffic, as was done was in my opinion a little over the top.
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Gilbert B Norman
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quote:
Originally posted by Gilbert B Norman:
....with friends where I'd best keep my thoughts about Joe's disappointment to myself, for his agenda is quite revered where I will be (he: an Educator; she: a Social Worker).

Not only my friends in Indianapolis, but others such as the gal I invite to go to the Chicago Symphony with me and a neighbor who has taken me to medical "day procedures" such as that eleven lettered one beginning with "c".

Now as to my earlier reference of the Wolfgangsee, that is a lake (I must prefer the less commercialized Lake Fuschl nearby) located some 45km East of Salzburg and where, during '34, my maternal grandparents emigrated, owing to hatred of FDR ("he betrayed his own people").

Funny though, wonder why they "checked out" during '38 (oh in the same manner as did the Von Trapps in reality; which "ain't how they did so in the movie").

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George Harris
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quote:
Originally posted by Gilbert B Norman:
Now as to my earlier reference of the Wolfgangsee, that is a lake (I must prefer the less commercialized Lake Fuschl nearby) located some 45km East of Salzburg and where, during '34, my maternal grandparents emigrated, owing to hatred of FDR ("he betrayed his own people").

Funny though, wonder why they "checked out" during '38 (oh in the same manner as did the Von Trapps in reality; which "ain't how they did so in the movie").

I don't think we need to guess why they checked out during 38, and yes, the Sound of Music bears little resemblance to the true von Trapp story, and to salt their wounds, the von Trapp family got nothing from the movie people, which, among other happenings, is why I have little to no sympathy for the whole movie "industry" getting so up in arms about copyright issues.

You have my sympathy for going through the "c" procedure, having been through it a few times. For encouragement, I am now 4 years clear of any of the cancer found in my first trip through it.

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Gilbert B Norman
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Losing the support for "Build Back Better" from Sen. Manchin can mean either a major provision will get whacked, or there will be more piggies in barrels rolling to West Virginia. "Something" will be enacted.

But it sure takes "guts" to go against your president and your party. If "this Joe" chooses to run in place of, but not against, "that Joe" in '24, I could easily vote for him. To run "against that Joe" would completely shred whatever unity the Democratic party has at present. Bernie, Liz, and The Squad would be in open warfare against a President Manchin.

But President Joe, "We The People" did not vote for you to be "transformative" in the manner of FDR, LBJ, BHO, and on "the other guys" side of things, RWR. "We" voted for you to bring an end to the chaos corruption, and criminality that permeated through the Trump years, and that your sole goal, after helping those who have, and continue to be, honestly hurt by COVID, was to have a conciliatory "Bring Us Together" presidency. That is why "We" gave you a divided Congress, along with an adequately comfortable Electoral majority (same majority as prevailed in '16 for Trump over Hillary) to ensure no doubt you won.

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Gilbert B Norman
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quote:
Originally posted by George Harris:
You have my sympathy for going through the "c" procedure, having been through it a few times.

Don't mean to turn this into Medstory.com, but I had to "go in" this past September because I had Diverticulitis during July.

After a '14 procedure, the Gastroenterologist said I was clean, but he'd like to see me in '19 for an office visit. Being in the same network as is my Primary, he was able to review my two draws a year of blood. On the strength of that, he let me go.

However when I got the Diverticulitis, Primary wanted me to see "Dr. Gas" again, and so I was on the table and with no damage observed (lesions).

A wonderful neighbor supported me through the procedure.

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irishchieftain
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Again, there are not two Joe Bidens. There is only one, the “transformative” one. Only the media has claimed there is another.
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Gilbert B Norman
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Of historical interest, the last elected sitting president to be denied the nomination for a second term was POTUS 14, Franklin Pierce. He was "uh, not too great" as the Notable Scholars have ranked him 42 of 44 (Trump is 41).

The last UN-elected president, i.e. a succeeding VP, to share that dubious honor was POTUS 21 Chester Arthur, who succeeded the assassinated James Garfield. He too, "not too great".

So all told, should Joe want a second term nomination, it's his. Only problem, I think he will get "whupped" by anyone the Republicans choose to run.

Same story for Kamala, be she POTUS 47 or Candidate. I think the former, as I think Joe will resign. While not as soon, i.e. now, as I envisioned when opening this topic, but during First Quarter '23, rather than face a solid Republican Congress with any legislative initiative - well, beyond Omnibus and Defense spending bills.

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George Harris
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Based on whatever the number of the Amendment was that limits president to two terms, it allow a president who completes a term that has less than two years remaining to run twice, so the actual maximum time allowed to be in office is on the order of 9 years, 364 days. I think Kamala is both unrealistic and power mad enough to do whatever it takes to keep Biden going to not sooner than January 21, 2023.
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Gilbert B Norman
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Mr. Harris, the 22nd Amendment was ratified during 1951. POTUS 32 Truman, who took office some sixty-five days into POTUS 31 FDR's fourth term, would have been precluded from an elected second term had he not been "grandfathered". However, he did not seek that term during '52, fearing a likely defeat by "war hero" Ike.

The "big time return of COVID", I believe, has reduced any thought Joe has of being re-elected to ZERO. Same for your "gender opposite sur-namesake".

Had there not been COVID, and the economy remained strong (it would have), Trump would have been re-elected. Likewise, had Hillary won in '16, and COVID came a callin', and even if her response had been more aggressive than was Trump's, she too would have been defeated for a second term.

On that note, I bid you all a "Happy? New Year".

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And also, a Happy New Year to all.
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irishchieftain
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Has there been a “return” of COVID? or just an overblown hype campaign? And why is the response all over the world exactly the same? i.e. who is coordinating this? Besides all that, the US presidential elections are unaffected by it, save the power grab surrounding lockdowns that are misnamed “quarantine” by elected (and especially unelected) officials.
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Here is Kevin Dowd's (Maureen's Brother) annual column from this past Sunday's Times:

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  • Biden swept into the presidency on a wave of hope, a friendly press and a highly disliked opponent. He had run as a moderate, a creature of the Senate and a unifier, promising a return to normalcy.

    Donald Trump’s bungled effort to overturn the election and the ill-advised rally that ended with an attack on the Capitol further raised Biden’s standing.

    Once he became president, everything changed. Like one of the residents of Santa Mira, the fictional town in Don Siegel’s 1956 masterpiece, “Invasion of the Body Snatchers,” Biden looked the same but his actions revealed a startling transformation.

    The moderate Joe Biden was gone. The sweeping changes he proposed in the first few months sounded more like Bernie Sanders. Many of them backfired, severely damaging his early support.
Is this fellow and I ever on the same page!!!

I'm probably less a Republican than is he; hardly as "lib" as his sister. With my Presidential voting record to date - 7R, 7D, 1I - the "I" being a mistake I will never make again, I voted for Joe to do my part to get rid of Trump, but also on the strength that Joe would be a Centrist Democrat along the lines of Carter and Clinton. The first was successful - well, at least until Jan '25, but on the second, just like Mr. Dowd, I am sorely disappointed. All I could have hoped for with hindsight is that both parties found different candidates for '20; the same holds for '24.

Finally, Mr. Harris' point rings true regarding Ms. Harris; the news cycle has moved away from Afghanistan, so when both Houses of Congress "flip" a year from now, that is when Joe will "throw in the towel", retreat to the banks of the Brandywine, and play frisbee with, Champ, Major, and Commander. He has a lifetime of public service for which he can take much personal pride, but his (I think) two year "hitch" as POTUS46 is not part of such. I look for a 4th Quartile ranking (35th to 45th; Trump is 41 of 44) from the Notable Scholars.

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Gilbert B Norman
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Volks, Joe's speech yesterday delivered in the Capitol's Statuary Hall belongs on the campaign trail, where assailing candidates from an opposing party is a long standing tradition.

I voted for Joe for two reasons; 1) get rid of Trump, and 2) to "bring us together".

Yesterday only solidified Trump's present lead in the '24 polls over Joe or Kamala and will further arouse Trump's supporters even more resulting in a greater division, and possibly more violence, than at present.

I don't know from whom the speech writers were taking their orders. Possibly it was from others within the Administration, but if it were from Joe himself, he is simply "working overtime" to self-inflict more wounds to his already wounded presidency.

Somehow, I have to wonder if this Journal columnist "is on to something". Might "Joe the other" be "thinking '24"?

Fair Use:
  • Despite Mr. Biden’s mysterious out-migration to the Sanders-Warren left, we now have two prominent, nationally visible Democrats—Sen. Joe Manchin and New York City’s mayor—who argue the Democratic party’s future lies elsewhere.

    If the progressive policy disintegration continues in Washington and in the streets, someone in that party will have to pick up the pieces. How does Manchin-Adams sound?

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irishchieftain
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Again, Biden was always in the Sanders-Warren-Squad camp and had no intention of bringing anyone together.

Manchin has put his (and our) money where his mouth is, but Eric Adams is another one as radical as Biden-Sanders ad nauseam.

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Gilbert B Norman
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Mr. Helfner, if as you contend, Joe was always part of the Bernie-Liz-Squad camp, he sure had me fooled.

OK; for better or for worse, Obama was a transformative president - and in apparently a direction other than you would have wished. But I cannot recall any instance in which he used Joe to be a singular mouthpiece for his agenda. Sure of course back Obamacare; but how many other pieces of the Socialist agenda?

But I must hold; that if Joe has so openly embraced Bernie et al agenda, he had to be "on the QT" endorsing such during the Obama administration.

While I could never bring myself to vote for that "egomaniacal thug" (thank you, Maureen, in this past Sunday Times, for that one), if "Joe the other" were to run, as a Democrat, during '24, I just might be blackening that mighty sacred piece of pager for such.

But again, I hold that Joe only has another year to go; now will Kamala pursue the "Bernie et al agenda"? I don't think so. She will be that "caretaker president" "pardoning" turkeys and lighting Xmas trees (Vlad and Xi; be nice to the girl and give her a break) that I thought Joe would be - and not even run in '24 (Bernie and Liz too old: AOC, while eligible, too young).

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irishchieftain
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The way Harris entered politics says it all about her character, if her actions with respect to posting bail for 2020 rioters did not say enough.

And I for one will be happy when “transformative” is no longer used as a euphemism for shredding the Constitution and imposing socialism. (I write this as an old speech where B— claimed he would be “a president for all Americans” is on the radio.)

BTW, why are insulting epithets okay for 45 but not for “46”? particularly invective out of the dignity-free Grey Lady.

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irishchieftain
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More on Eric Adams: He just appointed his brother Bernard as deputy commissioner for the NYPD, a paid position, raising concerns of nepotism. And that is not the least of it: Adams just stood by a remarkably-unconstitutional city law allowing non-US citizens to vote (both legal and illegal), never mind Manhattan’s new DA Alvin Bragg saying that he will not prosecute many violent crimes.
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Gilbert B Norman
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Mr. Helfner, my point in citing The Journal columnist's piece was to note a source at which my "Joe the Other '24" thoughts are shared with national circulation.

At this time, should '24 be "Joe v. The Donald", I'll vote, because I even vote for dogcatchers off-year. However, I could well follow the lead of a long-standing friend who actively campaigned (doorbell ringing) for Hillary during '08 that she chose not to vote for anyone as president on the General Election ballot by simply leaving that line blank (I proudly voted for Sen. McCain that year, even if I knew he didn't have a chance post-Sept 15 - day of Lehman Brothers bankruptcy).

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irishchieftain
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Well, after discovering the late-80s editorial out of the WSJ where they were promulgating “a five-word constitutional amendment: ‘There shall be open borders’”, I take them with a grain of salt, particularly when they promote a narrative that the rest of the media try to push in the vain hope that a significant majority of the populace have thrown history down the “memory hole” to the point where they stay placated.

I cannot see how anyone could have been fooled by words Joseph Robinette B. did not even say, when he stated his radical positions quite openly in 2020 (saying to a black man that if he did not vote for him, “you ain’t black” being the mildest of same; he was quite adamant about opening the borders wide and encouraging illegals to crowd the border in fact). He was quite un-vocal as VP, while he had his boss around then to do the talking; but one exception was when he race-baited in 2012 by claiming in front of minorities that economic policies the Republicans promoted were intended to “put y’all back in chains”.

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George Harris
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Like Irishchieftain said. I did not expect anything good out of Biden, and the results have so far been worse than I anticipated. He has gotten away with ruling by decree more than any past president, and that only because he has the House in his pocket. When comparing him to his predecessor, think that his predecessor did not enrich himself while in public office, in fact the contrary, where we have both Biden and Obama worth millions which has come from who knows where? I could go on for a while, but I think it pointless and as I read back probably for the most part redundant.
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Gilbert B Norman
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Messrs. Harris and Helfner, somehow I think the last Former President to decease no wealthier than when he took the oath was POTUS 32 Truman. That statement, which is likely incorrect, is made on the strength of appearances where he spent his final years arranging his Library, which be it assured was hardly the "splash" that such for POTUS 44 Obama is on its way to becoming.

Lest we forget, Truman left Washington January 1953 in line space aboard the B&O National Limited, the B&O did however allow him time to be interviewed on the platforms at stops such as Cincinatti. For the St. Louis-Independence segment, the MP did provide his party with a Business Car. (source: New York Times).

The only other recent POTUS to take the appearances of a "Vow of Poverty" has been 39 Carter. Otherwise, our Former Presidents have a way of "going Hollywood" and become part of our "de facto Royalty".

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Gilbert B Norman
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Wow, just when I thought this topic was about to "die its cyberdeath", here comes this column appearing at the Journal's site and in print.

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  • A perfect storm in the Democratic Party is making a once-unfathomable scenario plausible: a political comeback for Hillary Clinton in 2024.

    Several circumstances—President Biden’s low approval rating, doubts over his capacity to run for re-election at 82, Vice President Kamala Harris’s unpopularity, and the absence of another strong Democrat to lead the ticket in 2024—have created a leadership vacuum in the party, which Mrs. Clinton viably could fill.

    She is already in an advantageous position to become the 2024 Democratic nominee. She is an experienced national figure who is younger than Mr. Biden and can offer a different approach from the disorganized and unpopular one the party is currently taking.

    If Democrats lose control of Congress in 2022, Mrs. Clinton can use the party’s loss as a basis to run for president again, enabling her to claim the title of “change candidate.”
While I cannot imagine either a Primary fight between Hillary and Joe or Kamala, I could between her and "Joe the Other".

I of course voted for her during '16; if '24 turns out be a rerun of such, I'll bet she would win. Both she and Trump "have their baggage", but I think she has a bit less than he.

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