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Author Topic: All Aboard Florida Happenings
Gilbert B Norman
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OK everybody; the AAF site appears to be "up and running" and I have taken the occasion to plot out a possible AAF joyride for Sunday January 28:

Station------------Time----Carrier

Arsht Center-------910A----Metro Mover
Govt Center--------925
---------------------------934------Metro Rail
Airport----------------948
-------------------------1017------Tri Rail
Ft Lauderdale---1105
FTL AAF Stn-----1225P----AAF--
WPB AAF----------105
-------------------------200
FTL AAF Stn-----240
Ft Lauderdale---356-----Tri Rail
Airport--------------450
-------------------------516-----Metro Rail
Govt Center------531
-------------------------545-----Metro Mover
Arsht Center-----600P

Nine hours on my only free day: tempting if I were more the railfan; otherwise "too much".

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palmland
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GBN, I think you got to do it. Looks like the AAF portion is only about 2.5 hours. If you have a rental car it should pretty easy. We all await your ‘up close and personal report’.
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Gilbert B Norman
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That's the rub, Mr. Palmland. I will not have a car. I was simply going to use Metrorail and Mover from/to the Airport. The concert venue is .25 mile from the Marriott and the Mover station is half that distance.

Now IF I make a second journey "down below" with my auto and staying in Boca, then an AAF joyride will be far more doable.

Now talk about "railfan dedication"; there's a fellow over at another site who is going to drive "on down" from South Carolina for an opening day joyride. Maybe it is from Hilton Head, but then it could be from Dillon.

But then, there are Cubs fans who have been to every Opening Day at Wrigley since they were "tykes" - and are now in the nursing home.

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Gilbert B Norman
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IT'S OPENING DAY!!

From my preferred news source for coverage of AAF affairs:

http://www.palmbeachpost.com/news/all-aboard-for-brightline-inaugural-rail-run/JninDvly5vzncsaNn4zhAP

Fair Use:
  • A big yellow train at the platform, a smattering of celebratory statements and Brightline’s inaugural run set off Friday morning, dignitaries aboard, for a high-speed ride down the rails to Fort Lauderdale and back.

    Some politicos acknowledged disappointment the company failed to finish construction of whatever’s required for horn-free running but no protesters materialized. Mayor Jeri Muoio’s absence was the most visible expression of city annoyance at the rail line’s last-minute revelation it would continue blasting horns through intersections for at least a few more months before completing its Quiet Zone work.

    Nonetheless the mood was laudatory.

    “When you do something this bold, this big, you can’t expect everything to be perfect,” City Commissioner Paula Ryan told the gathering of officials at the launch. “This is going to change the feel of the city for 100 years
OK, I concede; I never dreamed this day would come, but let's be honest, volks; what we have here at present is a Disneyland ride that hasn't a prayer of providing needed transportation through the Gold Coast region. Some may hold that serving Miami will make it economically viable as a Miami-WP "Super Shuttle".

I contend otherwise.

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Gilbert B Norman
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Here's the latest:

http://www.palmbeachpost.com/news/new-brightline-first-ride-fort-lauderdale-takes-off-hours-after-tragic-pedestrian-death/V5htwjEcBQ0bAJiOFy0H9N/

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DonNadeau
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quote:
Originally posted by Gilbert B Norman:
That's the rub, Mr. Palmland. I will not have a car. I was simply going to use Metrorail and Mover from/to the Airport. The concert venue is .25 mile from the Marriott and the Mover station is half that distance.

THIS is the time to download the Uber app to your smart phone.

1) No fare disputes with driver. Exact fare quoted online in advance & billed to your credit card once trip completed. No cash.
2) A map lets you track the progress of the driver prior to reaching you.
3) The driver has online access to the best directions to your destination. No worries that he or she may not speak English well enough to follow your directions or take you a tourist on a more expensive route.

I've used Urber a number of times in the Miami, Sunny Isles & Adventura areas & have been totally satisfied.

--------------------
@DonNadeau

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Gilbert B Norman
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Mr. Nadeau, I haven't ruled out the joyride. I've thought about a rental, but good luck getting and returning one Downtown on a Sunday.

Taking a taxicab up and back to FtL (or Uber, which I've never used in this life) would be a case of how much do I value my time - taxicabs ain't cheap in Miami $83.50 EACH WAY - neither are rented autos, although I remember the days when they were.

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MargaretSPfan
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Uber and Lyft have one huge problem: they rely totally on GPS, and if you need to be picked up at a large campus ptr fscility, you cannot tell the driver exactly where to pick you up or drop you off, as GPS can only accept street addresses, and cannot accept any other info, not even "Pick me up or drop me off at the (NE or SW, etc.) corner of X St. and Y St." GPS puts a pin on the map exactly where its program tells it that street address is, and that is where the driver will go.

I know this because I have used Lyft, and it is very frustrating. There is really no substitute for a really good taxi driver who knows the area and speaks your language -- which is very hard to find these days. But it is what we all need and deserve.

GBN --
Thanks for the explanation of why neither a rental or a taxi would work for you. None of that was obvious to me. I hope you get to ride Brightline some day.

I, too,hope Bridghtline can succeed, and will wait and see what happens.

(Has the rising ocean level impacted Brightline at all? Is it likely to in the near future? Just wondering.....)

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George Harris
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quote:
Originally posted by MargaretSPfan:
There is really no substitute for a really good taxi drier who knows the area and speaks your language -- which is very hard to find these days.

Totally off topic:
Ques:What is the main difference between a New York taxi driver and a Singapore taxi driver? Ans:You know the Singapore taxi driver will be able to speak English.

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palmland
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GBN, your comment about formerly inexpensive rentals in Florida reminded me of our first Florida trip with the boys in 1980. For $495 we got a RT to Orlando from Richmond in a bedroom down, coach return with a 7 day rental car, which we returned to Ft. Lauderdale. That was my last trip on a train with steam lines and no HEP. I believe it was also the last time we used a baggage car as it had our camping gear for Disney and the Keys.
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Gilbert B Norman
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From the Palm Beach Post, here is a "human interest" article:

Fair Use:
  • For now, the train ride is enough. Brightline appears to be proving, at least for now, that it’s the journey, not the destination that counts.

    And that’s the way it was for a lot of people on this, the first long weekend of train service for Brightline, a train that is expected to be a link between South Florida’s three big coastal cities and Orlando, but for now is just a gleaming new train service with just two stops
While the reporter did not use the phrase, so far it appears that AAF is a Disneyland ride (and from what I've learned, a whale of a lot cheaper than same is up the road). That will soon subside, and what remains to be told is how many will show up to ride during the next phase - a Miami-WP "Super Shuttle".
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Iron Mountain
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In order to stay on topic I will say that I am hoping for Bright Line's success. I have a son on the east coast of Florida and nephew on the west coast. I try to schedule a once a year trip to see them but the traffic is so unpleasant that I may cease my trips. It amazes me that the people in Florida cannot see the advantage of a good system of passenger rail.
I ran across an article this morning in the Daily Beast (www.thedailybeast.com/america-could-stop-half-of-train-crashes-heres-why-it-doesnt). It is not a very encouraging picture of the passenger train's near future in this country. Worth a read.
As to Uber I have had one experience with the service. We like to go to Kansas City from St. Louis via Amtrak. One of our favorite trips is to see the Cardinals play the Royals. We always stay in a downtown hotel. I have used a rental car, a taxi, and on the last trip, Uber to get to the stadium. Rating the three modes of conveyance I would say that Uber has them beat on all counts. Uber picked us up promptly at our hotel. The driver, a very clean cut young man, did not use the usual interstate route, but took an alternate route free of much of the congestion. The return trip was even more remarkable. As we exited the stadium, along with thousands of people, one of our party "Ubered" and within a few nminutes a car pulled up. Different driver but similar clean cut appearance. He also took an alternate route back to our hotel. The price was much lower than rental or taxi. I should add that the Royals stadium is a fairly good distance out of the city. I realize that different cities may have different situations.
We will find out this summer when we take my grandson to Washington D.C. and Philadelphia to take in the significant sights. We will be riding Lincoln Service, Capitol Limited, and regional trains.

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Gilbert B Norman
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Mr. Iron, here is a perfected link to the Daily Beast material you noted:

https://www.thedailybeast.com/america-could-stop-almost-half-of-train-crashes-heres-why-it-doesnt?ref=home

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George Harris
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The Beast article is, well typical for the Beast. Mostly if you think all problems can be solved by adding somehow one more layer of control, they are there. Generally it is mostly things already said warmed over.
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Gilbert B Norman
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Regrettably, I must note the Palm Beach Post reports that there has been a second fatal Grade X-ing incident. This incident occurred at Boynton Beach which is about ten miles South of W-Palm.

Hardly saying this is about to happen, and I'd like for it not to as I'm "coming down" in a little more than a week and am considering taking a joyride Jan 28, somebody is going to say "shut 'er down" until such time that AAF provides meaningful transportation beyond Disneyland joyrides. For at the moment with these two fatalities, both occurring within Palm Beach County that has yet to enact "QZ", the "public nuisance" (that is a legal term lest we forget) could well be heard.

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Gilbert B Norman
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The Gannett Treasure Coast Newspapers, "uh, not exactly", AAF's best friend out there, has posted this "graphic" video at their site.

Seccondly, for ready reference, here is the legal definition of the term "Public Nuisance" that I noted within the posting immediately above.

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Gilbert B Norman
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Aboard Tri Rail Miami Airport

Well I'm on my AAF joyride - well getting to it

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Gilbert B Norman
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From West Palm Brightline

OK, I'm impressed.

The Coach getting up here was clean and brand new. They offer comp water, and other snacks for purchase. There was an emergency stop near Lake Worth, and I thought "Oh Oh". That we were moving within two minutes suggest there wasn't a fatality. but I did note some kids "hanging around" the tracks.

Returning at 2PM, I have Business Class.

Have to add, this was my first ride on.FEC rails.

Now aboard the return (if they have train #'s, it's a State secret); Select is definitely the best - and most definitely worth the $3.50 surcharge. I just was offered a comp "grape juice".

Alright, it's a great joyride, but how much meaningful transportation does it provide? The WP Station Manager says "this quarter" for Miami. I didn't, but my reaction was, "girl, what you smokin'"?

Miami is a construction site, I couldn't really see, but I don't think there is even rail laid.

Orlando I have expressed my concerns enough - here at this site and others.

But all told this is a class act - no corners are cut.

I wish 'em well, I've never opposed AAF; just skeptical, and much as this joyride is well worth the $37.50 paid, my skepticism remains.

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Vincent206
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How was ridership like on your trains? I would imagine a fair number of people were there to kick the tires and take a sniff of the new train smells. Offering a train that looks good with stations that are convenient while providing a high frequency schedule with good on-board service will convince plenty of people to switch from driving.

The limited schedule isn't going to be a profit maker but it might help to overcome some of the resistance from the communities along the FEC right-of-way between Palm Beach and Orlando. Let's hope that bike riders will stop driving onto the tracks when the trains are rolling by.

The connection to Orlando will be critical for Brightline's success. Whatever local traffic they can gain between Miami and Palm Beach will be beneficial but it's the connection to Orlando that will determine success or failure.

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palmland
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Glad to hear you made it GBN, well done.

Also good to hear Brightline is the real deal as far as equipment and service. Financial viability - to be determined.

If there is a future for passenger rail in the U.S., this is it. It is not - chronically late trains with slightly seedy equipment, unhappy employees on tri-weekly schedules that is dependent on the whims of congress for funding.

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Gilbert B Norman
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Aboard Metrorail at the Airport, leaves 516P.

Ridership "pretty good", Mr.Vincent. Again, there is possibility this is the classiest act anywhere in North America.

There were plenty of cops along the ROW, but somebody has to pay for 'em.

Of any place on the existing route that I think the fatality is waiting to happen is Delray Beach. The FEC bisects an entertainment district, and some frat boy, even if in his 30's who never grew up is going to have had a little firewater ....this will cost AAF "heap big wampum".

So how long they will sustain these joyrides has to be questioned - and how long will it be until the public safety community says "shut 'er down". "The people have had their joyrides". "Come on back when you have meaningful transportation to offer such as serving Miami."

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Gilbert B Norman
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Now that I'm "back in the barn" and no longer having a "Lady in Blue" giving me a "no-no stare" for being on my phone ten seconds after they shut the door, I have to say the joyride was worth every penny spent on it.

From my looks at Miami Central, and especially since Metrorail gave me "a bit more time to stare at it" owing to some inexplicable delay (couldn't hear the station announcements and half of them were in Spanish) that "started to have me concerned" about making my flight (compared to ORD, TSA at MIA is "Keystone Kops"), but no problem in the end (United, being an MIA "bit player", has the "oh SO convenient" gates}, it won't be done for a year. This especially the case being the Class Act I found AAF to be, doesn't want their passengers walking over construction planks.

But reiterating, I hold grave suspicions that it's never going to get further than MIA-WPB - and that is an unsustainable business model.

Here is the latest "demand" by the opposition:

http://floridapolitics.com/archives/254332-brightline-safety-improvement-tab

Fair Use:

  • Brightline, the high-speed passenger train now running between Fort Lauderdale and West Palm Beach, could have to spend about $349 million on safety improvements.

    That’s after lawmakers and others, upset over the railway’s dangers, leveraged recent train-related deaths to push for more safety measures.

    Republicans Sen. Debbie Mayfield of Melbourne and Rep. Erin Grall of Vero Beach held a press conference Tuesday to express sympathy for those who died and to further stress the need for Brightline to comply with federal train regulations at the expense of the company—and not taxpayers.

    The train has been involved in four fatal accidents in which pedestrians or bicyclists were killed. Three accidents occurred during Brightline’s promotional runs, one of which was ruled a suicide.

    The fourth, involving a pedestrian who attempted to cross the tracks, occurred last Wednesday in Boynton Beach.
I cringed as the train went through an entertainment district at Delray Beach and at track speed. Volks, something IS GOING to happen there; too many people stumbling around having had too much firewater. Congested highways are generally marked for 35mph; and not 79mph.

I will not be surprised if, after the joyride thrills wear off, they shut down until Miami Central is opened. I highly doubt if the MIA-WPB "Super Shuttle" model will be sustainable.

I remain doubtful if it will ever be built Northward to Orlando. The opposition won't give up, and a fatality a week gives call to the issues addressed in the linked article. Further, I doubt if their business plan factored having to float "junk bonds" to build it out. That they apparently cannot float "investment grade" bonds will only raise the cost of the project without generating any additional revenue.

My advice, "get on down" and get your joyrides in.

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Vincent206
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If this type of behavior is commonplace in south Florida then it's not really "Brighthouse" that's acting irresponsibly or negligently. Apparently some public education and traffic enforcement is needed to get the public to understand the dangers of driving or cycling around flashing crossing arms.
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Vincent206
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If Brightline is as impressive and well done as Mr. Norman says, it will create momentum for intercity rail that Amtrak hasn't been able to generate in 40+ years. Mayors and business leaders in other parts of the country will be taking their joy rides and wondering "why can't we have this?" Unfortunately, the answer will usually be that there isn't any available rail infrastructure to build another Brightline. But people will see that just because Amtrak has failed, failed and failed to establish a meaningful intercity rail system outside of the NEC, it doesn't mean that it can't be done. I would expect many of the shelved proposals to get another look. Why can't Los Angeles to Las Vegas, Atlanta to Charlotte, Houston to Dallas and Chicago to almost-anywhere-within 300 miles be served with modern, high(er) speed trains?
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Gilbert B Norman
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Although I'm not going to a concert at Kravis this year while I'm "down below" Feb 18-20 (the Chicago Symphony will be performing there, but it will be the same program that I heard last Friday at Orchestra Hall). I could possibly put Brightline to use to get from Ehh to Bee.

Here's how: drive to Ft. Lauderdale (from the Holiday Inn at Turnpike Exit 75), park at the "intro-free" garage, take Brightline to WP, walk to Ruth's Chris adjacent to Kravis, early Dinner (on my own; like to be gone from restaurants before they fill up), take Brightline back to FTL (that gives an hour to get .02 BAC out of me from any Grape Juice I had), drive back to hotel. Maybe I'll go Business NB and have a "comp" Grape Juice aperitif, SB Coach so "I'm led not into temptation".

Volks, I booked a ticket for my Feb 19 "joyride to chow". Up 355P in Select. Back 7P in Smart. Booking went very smooth.

What's another $22.50 when I've already laid out an "only sort of refundable" $814 for Auto-Train!!!

I have to give them credit for a smooth rollout. I'm not opposed to AAF; I'm just skeptical. They haven't a prayer if all they build is MIA-WPB (after seeing MIA first hand last week, I say a year to go, even if they are saying next Quarter, i.e by June 30) and only a slight one if MIA-ORL is ever completed.

All I ask is keep the Delray Beach "revelers" away from my trains. Anyone else around here know of that entertainment district at Atlantic Ave? The Late Randy Resor once did as his Mother lived in Delray. He pointed out to me how it parallels the FEC and said before Brightline was ever dreamed of "there's going to be a moose-goosing here one of these days".

Again I say; "get on down" and get your joyrides in.

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Vincent206
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Were you able to book a specific seat when you made the reservation? One of the perpetual frustrations of Cascades riders is the inability to book a seat reservation until 30 minutes before departure. Of course, the Cascades trainsets have a variety of layouts depending if the set is owned by Washington or Oregon or if it's the Las Vegas trainset or if it's a Superliner substituting for one of the Talgos. Brightline at least has identical seating layouts in all its trainsets.
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Gilbert B Norman
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Absolutely, Mr. Vincent.

NB Coach 1 Seat 39 (Select)

SB Coach 3 Seat 18 (Smart)

I give them much credit for having "thought of everything".

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Gilbert B Norman
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Volks, they appear to have "issues" with their ticketing system. I opened my American Express page and, voila, what did I see!

Two tickets for one me - same seat for both trains.

Here's what they have presently posted at their "chat" box:

quote:
If you have duplicate Brightline charges, please know that we are aware of the issue, and you will be issued a refund. If you made a booking and have not received an email with your ticket confirmation, it’s possible your reservation did not go through. If you made a booking and are unsure if you have a ticket, please reply back with HELP.
Oh well, what's another $22.50 (Select up Smart back less Veteran discount) on a trip that I will likely run up $3K.

....and maybe, just maybe, I'll see a credit on AMEX

Posts: 8650 | From: Clarendon Hills, IL USA (BNSF Aurora Sub MP 18.71) | Registered: Apr 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Gilbert B Norman
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ANOTHER "WHACK-A-MOLE":

Miami Herald

Fair Use:
  • The man injured by a Brightline train in Wilton Manors on Thursday had attempted to kill himself when he walked along a stretch of tracks and lay on the metal awaiting an approaching train, police said.

    The 48-year-old Broward County resident, whom police have not identified, endured non-fatal injuries when he was struck by the passenger line around 8 p.m. in the 1200 block of Northeast 24th Street. He was taken to Broward Health Medical Center to receive medical treatment and mental health assistance, according to a statement releaed by Wilton Manors Police.
Oh well, at least this one was non-fatal.
Posts: 8650 | From: Clarendon Hills, IL USA (BNSF Aurora Sub MP 18.71) | Registered: Apr 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Gilbert B Norman
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I have now been able to cancel one of the duplicate tickets Brightline "sold" me. So apparently, they have addressed the "bugs, glitches, programming errors" whatever.

Now let's see if American Express gets the word.

So at this time, or so far as they are concerned, it's one ticket for one me Feb 19 North at 355P in Select, return 7P in Smart.

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palmland
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Mr. Norman, it seems to me you’re again becoming a railfan, albeit confined to Brightline!

Hope the general public has the same reaction. I don’ t recall if you mentioned any food being available and it’s quality. Have a good trip.

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Gilbert B Norman
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No credit as of this morning, but as any "shopaholic" around here (Miss Mary perchance?) knows, both the merchants and the card issuers "have their way of taking their time".

We shall see how this one plays out; on Monday at Penney's, I bought a pair of Black Florsheim shoes. Yesterday, after heaving the box and Republic Services had come by, I looked in my closet, and there was a perfectly serviceable pair of dusty Black Florsheims that I'd forgotten I had (my closet is about the same size as that found in a hotel room - not some lighted walk in "stage"). I took them back to Penney's where some low level "Customer Service Rep" said "sorry Charlie, can't take 'em back - no box". I then asked for a Manager. I got a Supervisor who was in radio contact with the Mgr. I offered to pay a reasonable restock fee, but all I heard was "never been worn" (truth; save the one minute I had "tried 'em on"). He then proceeds to issue me a credit for $97.19. I had looked at their website to see if there was anything in a color I needed (Tan), there was (Eastland brand for all I cared) so I asked this 20 something "Management Trainee" could he help me with a catalog sale? "Of course, that's what I'm here for". He did all the punching and clicking for me and out comes the $102.60 charge, which is already posted to my Capital One Visa.

The $97.19 credit? well let's call it a "work in progress".

Moral of all this unrelated stuff; "charges first, credits whenever."

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Ocala Mike
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That's called playing with OPM, Gil (Other People's Money)!
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palmland
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For the record,GBN, Mary is decidedly not a shopaholic. Now, a quit, yarn, or fabric store is another matter. Fortunately. those stores are likely to exist in any town where there is a rail yard, station, or MR hobby store. That way everyone is happy on road trips.
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Gilbert B Norman
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Paddukki Kentucky for both rail and quilting aficionados.

When those quilters come to town for an annual powwow, they will fill up hotels in Marion IL -50 miles away.

Know so first hand.

Posts: 8650 | From: Clarendon Hills, IL USA (BNSF Aurora Sub MP 18.71) | Registered: Apr 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
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From Holiday Inn Express Boca Raton

Brightline did credit my account for the duplicate ticket they issued me.

But today has not been it for me and electronics. After having Lunch with Ocala Mike in his namesske, I went to a gas station and I couldn't get my card to work the pumps. They said something wrong with them. Since I tried three times, Capital One locked my Visa. After a phone call with C1, they unlocked it and I got gas - at another station.

Now I get down here and the hotel is full - and the key for the one room they had left does not work. So the desk clerk has to escort me to it - and any time I leave, I'll have to be escorted back. They say the Building Engineer is on his way in to see what he can do - we will see about that! I went to a bar adjacent to the hotel for some Grape Juice and also to try out the Visa - it worked.

So, happy arrivals in Boca.

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Glad you made it safely, more or less, to Boca, Gil. At least we had a pretty good lunch at Chefs Di Napoli. Safe journey the rest of the way!
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From Holiday Inn Express Boca Raton

The key matter was resolved this morning. This afternoon it will be Brightline to West Palm and a steak at Ruth's Chris.

Posts: 8650 | From: Clarendon Hills, IL USA (BNSF Aurora Sub MP 18.71) | Registered: Apr 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
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From Ruth's Chris West Palm Beach

The Northbound in Select is now in the books. The car was substantially full, and the trip was without incident. I still fear a WHACKAMOLE at Delray Beach - it will be some hotshot lawyer whose family will "take em for everything".

The Select Attendant, Miss Brooke, was exceptionally courteous - kind of like a Flight Attendant you remember for good reasons.

I realize this is an introductory period. The trains are new and the staff enthusiastic. But this enthusiasm does not translate into a sustainable private sector operation. Obviously no one can hold "they're making it" during this "intro" phase. While their fares planned "post intro" are a State secret", I think them to be double the "intros".

Access to Miami will certainly give them business beyond joyrides. With the Miami location right with the Miami judiciary, some Palm Beach attorneys will find it convenient.

I continue to hold the only "prayer" they have for private sector operation is to complete the route to MCO. They could well have a B-School Model showing "them making it", but did such contemplate the funding they would need and the "junk bond" rating translating to higher debt service costs than anyicipated.

Even if they choose not to lay the 40 miles of track and.offer a bus transfer in it's place, will that cut it?

Sure I've enjoyed these joyrides on an.outfit that puts customer service.on a plateau with air travel during the '50's, but I still say "get on down and get your joyrides in".

Posts: 8650 | From: Clarendon Hills, IL USA (BNSF Aurora Sub MP 18.71) | Registered: Apr 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
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At about 12:30 within the link is a focus on the Delray Beach Atlantic Avenue X-ing at which I am fearful "something bad" is going to happen:

https://youtu.be/PhaOVwG9eTM

This X-ing I think represents a far greater hazard than do either illustrated in Ft. Lauderdale. Broward Blvd is immediately South of the station, so any BL train has stopped, and when the Miami service begins (I still hold such will be closer to Xmas than Easter), the NB trains, Freight and Passenger, will be approaching the station at a Restricted speed. While nothing beyond their self-centered idiocy, can explain those "not exactly homeless or on welfare" folk from climbing over the freight train at 1st St SE, any train is moving over that X-ing at Restricted speed.

Despite my absolute astonishment that I have held throughout these pages, AAF is moving forward. Actually serving Miami, as well as inevitably charging "market" fares (my guess for Miami-West Palm will be $45 Coach, $65 Business each way), the hemorrhage the operation has to be experiencing will be curtailed to some extent.

Posts: 8650 | From: Clarendon Hills, IL USA (BNSF Aurora Sub MP 18.71) | Registered: Apr 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
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